Magox

I've been trying to find it too...

No, it is not unreasonable to find Santorum's social engineering beliefs to be absurd. I don't like it. It's a turnoff for me, But I'm reasonable enough to understand that social issues, when its all said and done really can't be tremendously dictated from the executive branch and at the end of the day, the election is about a choice, and that choice for me is who can help turn around this economy and reduce the debt more so than the other guy? Meanwhile you are obsessing about the dude's sweatervest and if he may try to propose an amendment to the constitution that has no chance in hell of passing. Yeah, and I agree with you, I don't like that he was pork barrel spender, but again, I'm rational enough to understand that one of the mandates that he would be elected if he were to get in that position (which I highly doubt) would be to cut spending, much more so than Obama. I also happen to like his manufacturing plan that he has, to not impose any capital gains taxes on manufacturers, which of course would help stimulate that segment of the economy. Would it be the silver bullet solution? Nope, but then again, from my perspective, there is no such thing as a silver bullet solution for our economic woes, but it is a bold idea that I happen to like. My focus is primarily on the economy and the debt, and that is what I mainly care about. If I had to put a number that represents the percentage of emphasis of how much I care about each issue national security about 20%, the economy and debt account for about 60%, centralized power about 15% and social issues about 5%. Now if you were to tell me that Santorum has stood on corners with signs that said "God hates Fags" or "Homos suck dick" then without a doubt that would automatically disqualify him for me, and I would just sit out this next upcoming election simply because I would see that as overtly hateful, and I believe we need to have a president who doesn't exemplify hate towards anyone. And please, don't show me a piece of legislation that he has proposed against gay marriage as an interpretation from you as him hating gays. Now if you have something that has shown that he has spewed hatred, then thats a different matter. I'm about as socially liberal as they get, I'm for gay marriage, pro choice, pro legalization of most drugs and a number of other issues, but when someone has a religious belief that they are against abortions and against gay marriage, I have the capacity to understand where they are coming from and respect their beliefs. I find it incredibly unfortunate that most people aren't able to be adamantly opposed to someone's view, but at the same time respectful of their religious beliefs. It's a religious belief man, its important to them, can't you see that? Like I said, if he is or was spewing hatred, that's another matter. I'll tell you whats really up, you just HATE when politicians commingle religion with politics. I remember, I believe it was you or Peace, I think, that I had mentioned John Thune as a possible candidate, and there you went, you basically went off the reservation and brought up a similar argument with virtually the same passion against him, simply because you perceive him to be some bible thumping politician that is incapable of tolerance. Face it, you have a serious hangup for this sort of stuff, that it creates so much hate within you that it clouds reason. Meaning that in matters that virtually have such little impact in what the presidency can do, that you would rather vote in a much less qualified president to guide us through this crappy economy and horrid debt issue simply because they are against gay marriage and pro choice matters. Now that is what you call unreasonable.

Yeah, I'd vote for him over Obama, without a doubt. So you care more about the social issues than the economy, Okey dokey, so i guess you are one of those kinda people. Thats ok you can worry about the social issues, I'll keep my focus on the economy. Also, as Adam and DC pointed out, I'm rational enough to understand that none of those things that Santorum wishes he could achieve, in regards to amending the constitution and all the other B.S would never ever happen.

Actually their routes were sort of in both. The problem with the business that my father didn't take into account was that up North, in heavily populated centers, the icecream trucks could stay parked in certain areas and the business would come to them, in other words they didn't have to drive that far. The problem is that we lived in North Carolina, where it is much hotter and they would have to drive longer distances and it was a nightmare to upkeep those huge diesel monsters. They were constantly breaking down. But anyway, I know you meant that as a dig at JW, carry on.

You may be right with most of what you said, but that's not the point of our debate, AND that still doesn't mean that most people find him to be despicable. I'm objective and reasonable enough to understand that, I think thats where you and I differ. And I really don't like having to defend a person that is not my sort of candidate at all, but whether you like him or not, he is seen as a likeable and a genuine candidate. Your strong views don't allow you to see that, and hey, that's ok. That's how you feel. But without a doubt, Romney makes a much better general election candidate, and his track record of turning things around, business acumen and governing over a liberal state while showing fiscal discipline is something that I find appealing. I just hope this Santorum surge is just that, a surge. My guess is that once they shine that big light on him, his weaknesses will get exposed. He's had the luxary of being able to throw punches at the other two candidates without getting hit back, lets see how he deals with it.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0212/72711_Page2.html#ixzz1lzarRHF4 Another quote from Rubio, and he makes the right point. I wouldn't be surprised if social conservatives such as Rick Santorum and others get so emboldened over this issue that they overplay their hand. If they go too far on the social side of things, it will turn off voters. This has to be about too much centralized power and the overreach of government. Yet another example of a politician like Rubio who is wise beyond his years. Btw, I just heard the White House caved in with a compromise. From what I read it will be based on Hawaii's plan, where they refer them to insurers who provide this sort of care. I imagine they strategically did this today to undercut the message of the GOP candidates at the CPAC convention.

No, you and likeminded people hate his guts. Does he have views that I vehemently disagree with? yes. Does that make him despicable? No, only to people who have strong views about religion and politics. Does wanting to amend the constitution = vile? No, it just means he's a pandering goofball. Does losing an election by a landslide equate to being seen as despicable in the eyes of voters? Of course not. Rick Santorum has always had these views, it's not a new revelation. You telling me that after 16 straight years of getting elected and reelected that all of a sudden they "hate his guts"? That just doesn't fly in the face of reason. Dude, you can do better than that. This sort of argument only works with dimwits. Sorry, JA Correlation does not imply causation, you can try to spin it however you like, but you can't win this argument in a rational manner, at least not with the arguments that you have provided anyway.

so much for sarcastic humor

That's just crass. And Ok JA, the people of Pennsylvania believe he is despicable and whatever other adjectives DiN used because he lost the election by 16 points. That's top notch logic you got there Oh, and there is no difference, you and DiN are likeminded

Really? I know it was late when you posted this, but come on.

My father owned some Mr. Softy trucks back in the days... That's all I got

Hey, you're the one who agrees with him on voter related issues.

Remember the health insurance debate? I provided lots of information on the bill, spoke about it at length and in substance. When Bmore decided to chime in, he would try to refute what I was saying, when I responded and made my case and explained to him in detail to why he was wrong, he responded by placing me on ignore. So much for "debate"

Oh the Irony

Believing someone is incompetent doesn't equate to hatred. I'm sure in your opaque narrow world, everything is either black or white, sorry Din, that's not how I roll.

I'm sure Old (*^*&%^$^#over at Meet the press won't show this clip this weekend while interviewing one of the whitehouse's mouthpieces

I hate to quote the DNC, but this election is about a choice, Obama or whoever the conservatives put up. Is Santorum my kinda guy? nope. Would I rather have him in office over Obama "You betcha". It's one thing for Senators and congressman to pander to their local constituencies it's another to govern as the president. What Im saying is that although I don't like his view on social matters, I won't automatically disqualify him for it.

Check this video out. http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/02/08/obama_in_2007_you_cant_be_against_outside_groups_and_then_for_them.html

DiN said that, then I responded that only likeminded people feel that way, then you said so do the people of Penn. Sorry, but losing by 17 points doesn't equate to people feeling the way he described. It just says that people were ready for change, they didn't like his policies and that it was a bad year to be a Conservative that agreed with Bush's policies. Also, I'm not quite sure one can be a champion of reason while being astigmatic. Sort of a oxymoronic....

Good luck with the new business

Fiscal conservatives who are socially liberal are usually the more rational thinking people. This in a perfect world is where the future should move to.

Sorry JA, your opinion on this topic doesn't really qualify you to be the most objective person regarding this discussion, considering your semi obsessive myopic viewed tendency to bash conservatives who express a desire to have religion influence their policies (which btw, I disagree with as well). By characterizing a person with terms such as "despicable", "very dislikable person", "hateful bastard" and somehow equating that to the results of his last election is a bit of a stretch and is an awfully shallow observation to conclude, specially by someone of your standards. It's ok to not like his politics or his demeanor but he is hardly seen as the characterizations used earlier by the majority of people of his state. Remember, you are an agreement with the "troll" Just for perspective

I think Spiller showed enough towards the end of the season that he could be the man. His explosiveness and playmaking ability was quite impressive and remember, he would of had another 40-50 yard touchdown run if it wasnt for that stupid penalty that had no impact on the play. Ideally I'd like see FJ extended, but I believe they are taking the right approach, there is no real hurry to extend him now, there is another year left on his contract. If anything, if he continues to play well (FJ) he could be in line for a decent contract as a FA. Lets not overreact, he will most likely get extended before the season end, barring injury.

Only people of your ilk feel that way.

I can answer that for you (from JAs perspective) no one. Not any of the one's running anyway. Which btw, I'm sure there are alot of guys wishing they did run this year. Jeb Bush, Mitch Daniels and Huck to name a few. Hell, I bet Mike Pence could of won it this year. I will say this, JA's dogmatic like view is bit narrow when it comes to politicians and their expression for religion. I usually find that absolutist points of view obstruct clarity and truth. However, most reasonable people don't like when people push their religious views on people and that is something that Santorum would have to work on, without a doubt. Yeah, I agree with you about Romney, and you may be right about Santorum. But without a doubt, I'm impressed with his campaign and his intelligence. He definitely has increased in value from my perspective.