metzelaars_lives

No he wasn't. Holcomb was only on the Bills in 2005; Edwards was drafted in 2007. He was stuck in a QB competition with Ryan Fitzpatrick, which he lost, leading to him getting cut after two games in 2010. Meanwhile Fitzpatrick has been a starting QB in the league ever since. You need to take a Bills history class or something.

HA! Have you read what I've written earlier in this thread!?! Of course he is. We agree on something! The OP is clearly not familiar with the '85 Bills.

What? I mean, WHAT?? This is right up there with Gugny declaring that EJ Manuel is better than Tyrod Taylor right now. In fact, it is even more outlandish.

I laughed. Whoops yeah I meant top 9.

Anytime anyone invokes Trent Dilfer it immediately takes the conversation down a long, dumb path.

That is simply not accurate. In 2006, he took every snap, threw for over 3,000 yards, 19 TD's to 14 INT's, ranked 12th in the NFL in passer rating and led a Bills team completely bereft of talent to a 7-9 record. Do you have any idea how many QB's in history could not stake such a claim? Literally hundreds. Including dozens of Bills QB's on this silly list. Sorry but for whatever it's worth (not much I realize), he goes down as a better all time Bills QB than certainly EJ Manuel and probably Trent Edwards (those two are as close as two QB's could possibly be). Which isn't to say they all did not suck. P.S. pretty funny that on Trent Edwards' official pro football reference page, it lists his nickname as 'Captain Checkdown.'

I would say that if nothing else, I would agree with the OP's top 13 QB's- in some order. In other words, that wouldn't be my order but I would agree that those are probably the top 13. But after that, it's almost as if he's picking names out of a hat. The order is completely random and has absolutely zero rhyme or reason to it.

Rico : Bledsoe = Gugny : Taylor apparently. He was not "the definition of the word 'suck'."

Whatever, Bledsoe was actually pretty damn good in 2002 and at least led them to a winning record in 2004. In no universe did he "suck."

I mean really, it's worth stating again: Vince Ferragamo and Bruce Mathison platooned during the '85 season (their only season as Bills QB's- was the season between Ferguson and Kelly), which was the worst season and certainly the worst QB'd season in Bills history. How can they both be ahead of Manuel, Losman and Collins, all three of whom were at least serviceable at times. How old are you anyway? http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/buf/1985.htm I mean anyone who's younger and wants to learn a little Bills history, look at the 1985 Bills season. They scored 200 points in 16 games. They were 2-14. Mathison and Ferragamo combined for 9 TD's and 31 INT's. That is not better than Manuel, Losman and Todd Collins. You are lacking some serious perspective here.

Bruce Mathison, in his one season, was not better than Todd Collins, in his one season. Believe you me. Nor was he better than JP Losman, or really, any Bills QB ever. And how was Trent Edwards decidedly better than JP Losman? Losman had a better season in '06 than Edwards ever had. Honestly this is not a good list at all. Not trying to be overly critical but you're way off. And how is Ferguson ahead of Kemp??

Ehh. It's not like he drops footballs. If you put him in a high-functioning passing offense he'd be just fine. Let's see what he does this year as he is more relied upon in the passing game. But I'm not gonna adamantly disagree with you.

I'm not so sure about this guy's analysis. We had a QB in his first year as a starter go 8-6, 20 td's to 6 int's, rank right near the top of the league in passer rating and YPA, lead the league in rushing for a qb and make the pro bowl, yet Gugny insists that Manuel is a better qb than said qb right now. So by that reasoning, Manuel must be pretty good.

Oh God.

Why? It wasn't really that big of a problem last year.

Paying attention to a 2017 mock draft < Girls watching Real Housewives AND The Bachelorette back-to-back

If you judge a head coach by their record relative to their perceived roster talent then yes, he just had his worst year as a head coach. This is a smart move if true. Does not vindicate him whatsoever. Time to put up.

Nope. You're wrong. If someone merely mentioned EJ by saying "hey I'm comfortable with him as my backup QB as long as Taylor doesn't miss extended time," I would say "yup, I pretty much agree with that." But when someone takes time out of their day every single day to say such things as: a) EJ Manuel is a better QB than Tyrod Taylor right now. b) Tyrod Taylor is the worst starting QB in the NFL. Like literally #32 c) I feel worse about the Bills' QB situation this offseason than I ever have in an any Bills season in my memory (mind you, this man is in his 40's) and then now: d) I really hope EJ lands somewhere with a decent coaching staff, preferably with a head coach who will give him a fair shot at the job, and not another head coach who wants "his guy," instead of, "the better guy." Then yes, I am fascinated by the alternate universe this man lives in.

Do you likewise wish for good things for Taylor? Has he not been a class act and a hard worker? Does he deserve great things? This obviously is not about football for you. What is it you love about EJ Manuel, the man, and loathe about Tyrod Taylor? I must know. I am fascinated by you.

Ahh it feels like the summer of 2015 all over again. Joe Montana also had horrible games. JP Losman had some really good games. None of that changes the fact that any objective observer could see that EJ Manuel was not, nor would ever be, a starting caliber NFL QB.

You missed the whole point of what I was saying. Let's say for the sake of argument that you are 100% right in your analysis and that play was 0% EJ's fault. Do you have any idea how bad he played in that game excluding that play? Do you have any idea how bad he played the previous week against San Diego? Do you have any idea how bad he looked that entire offseason and preseason? You should because they went out and signed Kyle Orton in an act of desperation after realizing that the whole EJ experiment might be in big, big trouble. And P.S. people do this all the time and it's so annoying. "Oh sure, it was EJ's fault that they gave up that drive at the end against Jacksonville..." No, it wasn't. What does that have to do with epic his meltdown in the second quarter? The defense essentially gave up 17 points that day. They held up their end of the bargain. After the Cincinnati game, in which the defense actually did suck, they said the same thing. "Oh remember when EJ missed that tackle on AJ Green..." No, the defense and EJ both sucked. Did you not take a logic class? Because the defense sucked doesn't mean that EJ must have been good.

Ha I think almost every Bills fan was optimistic about all of those QB's (except Flutie and Fitzpatrick, who clearly exceeded expectations). I was the biggest JP Losman fan I knew.

I was actually psyched about the EJ pick. To this day, I think it was the right pick at the time. That was the worst draft ever (literally). A guy who still plays right guard went first overall. Freaking Dion Jordan went like third overall, right? Is he even in the league at this point? And EJ came out of the gates great. After two games, even Jerry Sullivan was like "yup, the Bills nailed that one." I'll never forget- I was watching the Carolina game at Nevada Smith's in NYC going nuts: "we've got em! We've finally got out franchise QB!!" After that however, his regression was startling. A season derailed to some extent by injuries, he sucked most of the rest of that year, including debacles in New York, Tampa and Pittsburgh, among others. But top to bottom, ehh decent enough rookie season. Certainly worth handing him the reins his second year to see if he picked anything up in a full offseason as a starter. But then after two wins as a classic game manager, he played two of the most awful football games a player can play as an NFL QB. And then it began. All the TBD goodness that you and I have come to love so much, was born in an instant. You would hear things like "oh sure, ONE play (the JJ Watt play) and now he sucks..." Or my personal favorite, "ya know, Joe Flacco had a bad game against Houston once too..." Then after the 2014 season, there remained about, let's say, a quarter of the people on TBD who were still optimistic that he could pull something out of his ass and reclaim the starting job last offseason. I spent an entire summer telling those people they were crazy (along with my former ally FireChan) but they kept holding onto this dream. He lost the job and his stable dwindled to just 10-15 or so. "He never got a fair shot!" they would say. "He was actually better than Taylor- remember the scrimmage?!?" "The coaches were biased..." And then it happened. Jacksonville. London. The game- YOU WOULD THINK- that would eradicate any EJ believers once and for all. But no. Three men stood strong amongst all the naysayers. One of those brave men, Bills Fan 4 Ever, couldn't take the animosity and it drove him to the brink of madness- so much so, that he had to leave TBD altogether. Hope you're out there, somewhere, reading this little buddy. We miss ya. But two men- two TBD warriors- carry on the torch. And they fight the brave fight every day. Whether it be in the shoutbox or right here on the Wall- you can't miss em. And I commend those two men. Sure they might not know anything about NFL QB analysis and sure, they blatantly hold a grudge against Tyrod Taylor because they are still butthurt about EJ but I appreciate them making this place a little more colorful nonetheless. Ryan L Billz, Gugny... I salute you. We all salute you.

My question would be for Gugny- is Tyrod Taylor now the 4th best NFL QB on our roster with the camp invite to Joe Licata?

TBD false narrative #331: The level of QB play around the league is down from previous eras. Quite the opposite guys. There are 32 teams so naturally the teams with the 31st and 32nd best QB situations are going to employ guys like Fitzpatrick, Hoyer, etc. There's always been Fitzpatricks and Hoyers. People always rate the best QB's in the league and almost invariably, a guy like Matt Stafford is right around 15th or 16th. Guys, do you really think that in 1976 or 1986 or 1996, the average QB in the league was better than Matt Stafford? There are like five sure fire hall of famers playing right now. You wanna attribute it to rule changes? Fine. But the level of QB play in the NFL has never been better than it is right now.