metzelaars_lives

We should probably just end this thread on that note. In all seriousness, I sincerely hope that the people who are certain he has nothing to give in the NFL after, again, a pretty good preseason with the Rams last year, are not the same people who have these magical dreams of EJ becoming good someday.

I would hope not. Nor did I create a topic and opine that the Bills should take a look at Michael Sam. Nor do I want them to. But just because people don't adamantly follow who wins the SEC DPOY every year does not invalidate or cheapen the award- as evidenced by the great players who won it every year from 2005-2012. All of whom except two, Buffalo Joe has never heard of.

Look if I was at a bar playing sports trivia and you asked me to name SEC DPOY's over the last decade, of course I would've guessed some of those names- Peterson, Berry, McClain, Willis, probably Dorsey. Certainly you have been able to deduce from my posting history that I am a knowledgeable football fan. Do I watch the SEC DPOY award ceremony every year or pay any attention to who wins the award? Of course not. So if that is your point, you win. EDIT: But I just don't understand your point! If the Bills were scouting out a QB from, I don't know, Central Michigan and you happened to hear that he was the MAAC offensive player of the year, would you say "oh that's a nice award, I'm a little more interested now" or would you say, "nope, don't know who has won past awards so I cannot like that he won that award, sorry."

Yes and I told you, without giving it any thought whatsoever, that Eric Berry probably won one. And my biggest argument for Michael Sam getting another look was that, from what I saw, he had a pretty good preseason with the Rams last year. Didn't he get like 3 sacks or something? If a 7th round pick for the Bills last year got 3 sacks in the preseason and yes, was a former SEC DPOY, and they cut him and someone mentioned the Bills giving him another look this year, would everyone be saying, "No! He sucks! Get him outta here! Those plays were against 2nd and 3rd stringers! Arrrrrgggghh" That Cohen guy looked great against 2nd and 3rd stringers last preseason. Would people be pissed if we took a look at him? So is there bias against Michael Sam in this case? Of course there is. But to your point, I agree that his winning SEC DPOY in 2013 (even if I knew who won every award- which again, I have no idea where you were going with that) doesn't mean anything to me if I'm grading him out in my training camp this year. And finally to your point about the SEC DPOY, just because I don't know who won the last 15 Hobey Baker awards doesn't mean I'm not allowed to say to someone, "hey Jack Eichel won the Hobey Baker. That's pretty cool." Because there are people who do know who won the Hobey Baker every year. Just like there are people who happen to know who wins the SEC DPOY award every year. So if you happened to be arguing with one of those people, your argument would be completely invalid. What if I said, "well actually, here's who won it every year..." Would you say, "Oh I was wrong and you were right. The SEC DPOY does mean something." Because there are people out there who probably could tell you who won it every year. I know Johnny Gaudreau and Brian Holzinger have won the Hobey Baker fwiw.

Yeah and in this case the previous "captains" have all been great football players so what in the world is your point? Because we had to look up who won the award, what does that have to do with anything? I'm completely lost here.

And good sir, I never once said that at all. All I said was that he had to have been decent in college to win the award because others were saying "ahh he got a few sacks against Vanderbilt, otherwise he did nothing." And having never seen him play a single snap in college, I can assure you that the voters watched many snaps and he must've been pretty good in all his games to win that award. In other words, I doubt the voters. like me, never watched a snap of Missouri football in 2013 and said, "hey this guy had 11.5 sacks? Sounds good to me. Let's vote for him." It means he was good in the SEC. That's all I have said in this thread. And yeah, still curious who, out of Patrick Peterson, Eric Berry and Patrick Willis, you had never heard of.

Hey are you a hockey fan? Tell me who's scored the most goals in the league (Maurice Richard trophy) every year for the last 15 years. Ha! You couldn't! That necessarily means that scoring the most goals doesn't mean anything at all. I could apply this same thing to any sport. Who has been the 6th man of the year in the NBA the last 15 years? I guess that award means nothing. OK, who has won the last 15 NL batting titles? I guess you can toss that award out the window. I guess I just don't understand how me not knowing who won the SEC DPOY award every year undermines the importance of the award. I was certain that when you first started bringing it up that it was going to be a list of lousy players but was startled when it was filled with incredibly talented first round talent. I'm kind of at a loss as to where you're going with this one.

Oh. My. God. You maybe shouldn't be spending your time posting on a website about FOOTBALL. Between 2006 and 2012 every one of the those players was taken in the first round. Ryans was a second rounder (I believe) and has been a great pro. What I want to know is, who out of Peterson, Willis and Berry have you never heard of!?! It's erroneous that he won SEC DPOY? There was an error made? Not sure I follow. And no I don't follow who wins the award every year. Off the top of my head before I looked it up, I guessed that Eric Berry had probably won it and he did. Not sure how this list proves any point. Between 2005 and 2012, every single of those players was a complete stud in the NFL and/or a guy who was drafted extremely high and been a decent NFL player or undetermined (Claiborne and Jones). Not that I think Michael Sam is even good! I just don't like it when people come up with dumb arguments.

Jarius Wynn and Corbin Bryant were both castaways that ended up becoming very important parts of the best d line in the league. I'd have to look it up and don't feel compelled to. I'm sure some great players have won it though. I'm sure some players that never amounted to anything in the NFL have also won it or you wouldn't be harping on the point.

They probably both should've been mid round picks. Tebow was one of the greatest college players of all time. My point is that in 2015, it's clearly not happening for Tebow (even though he's only started 14 games), while, based on his preseason performance last year, it wouldn't be absurd to think that Sam could sneak onto a roster this year. Likely? Probably not. Does the circus factor into him probably not making a roster? Probably. Has he fanned the fire that is the circus? Yes. And also fwiw Tebow didn't have to make a roster. No first round pick that I'm aware of hasn't been on an NFL roster his first two seasons.

I'm actually impressed that this thread wasn't as ignorant as it could've been. I agree with most that if he was good enough to be on an NFL roster then he'd be on one. That being said, from what I recall he actually had a pretty good preseason with the rams last year and as long as he's been working out it wouldn't be ridiculous for him to get a shot in someone's camp again this year. And to those of you who apparently watch every SEC football game, you don't luck your way to SEC DPOY by piling up a few sacks against inferior opponents. I'm sure the voters watched more games than you in 2013 and I'm sure he was pretty damn good. Can he produce enough at this level to make a roster? Probably not but please don't compare him to Tim Tebow. He's not a joke of a football player.

This is so ridiculous. How many Fred Biletnikoff jerseys have really been ordered in North Dakota? I'm almost inclined to think that there has only been one and that was the only jersey ordered in the whole state. Same with a Dave Winfield Padres jersey in Maine? What?

Not sure what your issue with Del Rio is. He would always lead those Jacksonville teams that everyone thought would be the worst team in football to 9-7 every year. Although I guess that contradicts my post from earlier. Oh well.

I love how this site is full of people who say you can't possibly know anything about a QB who has been in the league for two years and others who are certain about a QB who hasn't gotten drafted yet. And in many cases, the same people are maintaining both of these stances.

When people talk about how good of a coach all these guys are, all they're talking about is the results they are able to get relative to the perceived talent on their roster. No one knows how good they are at actually coaching football players. For all we know some of the higher ranked coaches don't say much and their assistants do all the work and some of the lower ranked coaches are amazing at coaching football players but they are stuck with a roster that just isn't jelling for whatever reason. No one knows. It is ignorant of the author to assert that they know how good of a coach all these guys are.

If the Bills had Philip Rivers right now, they would be considered a top 2-3 team in the league going into this season, if not #1. With the three-headed monster at QB, they are probably somewhere in the mid-teens, maybe like around 13-14 or so.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Did Bills fan 4 ever really say he wouldn't trade EJ Manuel for Philip Rivers? I went back a page or two and couldn't find it. I think Bills fan 4 ever I a little naïve to think that getting Rivers is going to be impossible. I happen to think he is going to be available and where else would you rather go if you were a QB trying to win a Super Bowl than the Bills right now? It is an ideal situation for a QB. I don't think it's that far-fetched at all to think that Rivers is in play in 2016. Also, did he really cite one game where the Chargers blew a lead in an effort to illustrate that Rivers isn't actually all that good when he spends most of his time condemning people for saying EJ Manuel isn't that good? Am I missing something here?

Yeah that's pretty much all that needs to be said as far as this thread goes.

That's not happening. Not unless he wants to come play in Buffalo instead. Guarantee you the Broncos are trending downwards.

Not arguing here, promise. You did say though that you can't say whether Andrew Luck will "do good or bad" (I see you have since edited that). All I'm saying is that it is fair to say that we will do much good in this league, I can assure you of that. And getting back to the topic at hand, the Colts will never let him go in a million years so this is a moot topic. The guy we should be talking about is Philip Rivers because he very well could be the Bills QB in 2016.

No one on planet Earth would say Luck sucks, I didn't say you said that. I think it's OK though for you to start formulating opinions about players after they've been in the league for a few years. Andrew Luck is going to "do good," I can assure you. He is going to be in the hall of fame someday and win at least one, if not several, Super Bowls. If the Sabres get Connor McDavid next year and he scores 100 points as a rookie are you gonna say, "well guys it's too early, we just don't know yet..." Because that is the trajectory that Luck's career path is on. I will give you credit though- you stick to your "we just don't know yet" mantra whether a guy looks amazing or completely sucks.

And for what it's worth, Peyton Manning (who turns 39 today) didn't win one playoff game until his fifth year in the league.

So to be clear, you are somewhat dubious of where Andrew Luck's career may be headed but you are a staunch defender of EJ Manuel and his magical mysterious upside?

What does that mean? I mean I understand the emperor's new clothes reference- are you intimating that everyone says Andrew Luck is so good because it's what you're supposed to say but that certain people in the know realize that he's actually not that good?

Oh my God. He's been in the league three years and singlehandedly taken his team to the playoffs each season. He has taken one step forward each year- the first year they made it but lost in the first round, the second year they won a game, the third year they won two games. I'd say that I like the direction his career is headed.