thewildrabbit

Couldn't agree more. Gotta love the guy! You know how upset I'll be if Orton gets injured because this staff went forward with the same scrubs on that line, and no solid depth to boot.

Ya know, I might see things differently if Hackett's run game was actually effective the last two years besides in just a few a few games. I wouldn't be as concerned if the Bills had shown the ability to run in most every game like they did last year against Kansas City Chiefs in week 9. With 38 rushes for 248 yards the Bills were dominating that Chiefs vaunted high ranking defense...all the way up until Hackett got cute with Tuel. Then he went pass happy, but that is another story. The point here is despite the Bills leading the NFL in rushing attempts, and #2 in yards rushing last season, it didn't matter because the Bills couldn't effectively control either the line of scrimmage or the clock. The Bills were near last in 3 downs, and out because they couldn't gain first downs by rushing. They couldn't convert many 3rd downs in third, and long by passing because of all the rookie QB's. Hackett's offense was so bad he garnered the nickname "Hurry up and punt offense". The problem with the offense is the exact same thing that was the problem last year, and it was with two lousy OG's, and a lousy RT. Now this year they are having problems because they didn't upgrade the OG positions properly. Does anyone else recall what Morrone stated after last season about the run game? He said, " we must be doing something right to be #2 in the NFL". So in effect, he doesn't get it either. Comparing the Bills to what the Chargers did in one game is kind of silly considering their run actually game works against other teams despite them being without their two starting RB's. Just because they kept running against Buffalo and it wasn't working doesn't mean that its ok to do that every week. The Chargers keep running the ball because they run a lot of play action passing, and running actually sets that up.

Great stuff, and it just shows how lame the current coaching staff is, and its just a darn shame that the Bills didn't have a better OC to actually help Orton. The sky could be the limit with proper coaching, and some talented OG's. How the eff was EJ supposed to learn anything from a dork who is clueless. He is now learning from Orton tho.

Offensive guard remains the biggest need after two years of allowing Levitre & Rinehart to walk for whatever reason, and the Bills need two starters. Chris Williams wouldn't be one of them, and either would Urbik or Pears. I've seen enough of a below average player falling on his face playing against the better teams. I don't see why Orton can't be the starting QB for the next 5+ years, (that is, if he survives this season playing behind the worst O line in the game) and if that is the case there is no need for a early drafted QB. Perhaps EJ might still develop with a better OC, or picking up a 3rd-4th rounder at some point to develop. Still, I don't ever see this current OC developing any QB under any circumstances. I'd say TE as the second biggest need and, hopefully with a new OC that would figure out how to use him. Has this franchise ever had a top TE in its storied history in the NFL? Two top OG's alone would be enough to transform this offense into a better running, scoring team. A top TE would only enhance that offense, JMHO.

That first sentence in making an excuse for Hackett makes it sound like the QB is a liability, and he is the opposite of that. In fact the QB in Kyle Orton is the biggest reason why the team is now 5-3, along with Sammy, and the defense. That is the QB is playing great despite the Bills OC, and his lame run plays. Hackett is his own worst enemy as this season he is still using the run plays that were pretty much ineffective in getting first downs all last year, and that was with some excellent RB's in Fredex & CJ. Now both are out with injuries, and Hackett now has to make things work with RB Boobie Dixon, FB Frank Summers & RB Bryce Brown, along with untested RB Phillip Tanner. The Chiefs currently are ranked #3 in total defense, and #1 in pass defense, and 11th in run defense. That's the bad news, and the good news is the Chiefs offense is ranked worse then Buffalo at 17th to KC ranked 27th. Kansas City is 31st in passing, and 7th in rushing. Buffalo is next to last in rushing first downs, and only Oakland is worse. The Bills are 18th in 3rd downs while KC is 6th because of their better run game. The Bills run defense is going to tested big time by Jamaal Charles & Knile Davis. The Bills defense is currently ranked 10th overall, 9th in rushing, 18th in passing. #4 in takaways, and the Bills are #1 in sacks with 28. The Chiefs are right there with 24.

Thanks . Lest everyone forget that the 2008 Buffalo Bills started out 5-1, and shortly after Jauron was a awarded a contract extension only to see the team go 2-8 after that. They finished that year at 7-9, and I highly doubt if you asked any Bills fan what record the team would finish that season with at the 5-1 mark, you would be crucified if you said anything other then playoffs. I put that seasons fall from grace squarely on the shoulders of their then offensive coordinator, rookie OC Turk Schonert. Who in 6 of those 8 loses didn't find a way to get the team to score more then 18 points, sound familiar? Whats interesting is Nathaniel Hackett was an assistant with the Buffalo Bills in charge of offensive quality control from 2008-2009. Then in 2011 the Bills started out 5-2 under Gailey, and it all went south once Eric Wood went on IR after week 9, against the Jets. Just like this year the Bills now have no backup plan for Wood, or Urbik, Pears, and should any go down for any amount of times its back to Richardson or worse. That year Fitz was also playing with broken ribs because Gailey didn't trust his backup QB's in Tyler Thigpen & Brad Smith. While the defense was also very bad that season, you could also say it might have been helped by an offense that couldn't stay on the field with a weak run game and to much passing. After week 9 in 2011 the Bills went on a 7 game losing slide, and a lot had to do with the offense falling on its face with not being able to score enough. I'm not advocating firing Hackett at this point in time, as there really is nobody able to take over that I can see. Whaley needs to search high,and low to find an acceptable RG, and the team might have a better chance this year. Then what I would do is borrow from a different run game playbook, and start thinking of running something, anything other then up the middle on second down. Or here is a novel idea, to pass on second down. Find a way to get Sammy the ball on first, and second down, and there probably won't be a third down. Now granted the Bills have a much better defense then in 2008 & 2011, and it is now a top ten unit. Still, if the offense can't find a way to more then 18 points without the multiple defensive turnovers they may be in deep trouble. Plus, I gotta wonder will the injury bug to the O line come back to bite them again, as they have no viable depth. Lets hope the team figures things out during the bye week, and corrects some of the issues....unless they think that at 5-3 they must be doing something right!

and so Is Kelvin Benjamin was my point. In order for him to distance himself it would be nice if he was targeted more often... and never, ever used as a decoy again!

Its not just one missed block, as the entire line stinks at run blocking. As was posted in a different thread. My take is that the bad play of the OG's is making the rest look so much worse, and that's with Urbik in there at LG. I dunno, perhaps once they play a few games together they will get better by gaining some continuity. I still have no idea why Whaley hasn't tried to bring in anyone, as Pears is a complete disaster at RG, and dragging Wood down with him.

agree, and this team could be an offensive powerhouse with better OG's and coaching. Its as simple as that. Last day of trade deadline

Since everyone seems to be speculating about taking Eric Ebron at that #9 spot. While I wouldn't have targeted a TE at all with that first pick and instead would have preferred to take OT/OG Zach Martin who went @#16 to the Cowboys. Thus a trade back could have occurred in allowing the bills to pickup an extra #2 or #3, and then still being able to obtain a OT-TE-WR. However all this is moot considering the Bills did trade for Sammy, and gave up two 2015 picks in the #1 & #4 picks. What I do find ludicrous is the way this coaching staff is utilizing Sammy in his limited receptions in some games. Chicago 3 W, Miami 8 W, San Diego 2 L , Houston 4 L, Detroit 7 W, New England 2 L, Minnesota 9 W, NY Jets 3 W = 38 receptions. Looks to me like a direct correlation that the more Watkins touches the ball the more chance they have to win. BTW in that last game he had only 3 catches yet for 157 yards, one TD. While slightly ahead of Kelvin Benjamin who has the same amount of receptions, TD's, and almost the same targets, yardage. Sammy is killing Kelvin with his YAC in 102 to 68. What my beef is now that we all see what Doug Whaley saw in Sammy, and yet it looks like his coaches are holding him back. From what I see he could easily be the rookie of the year by a wide margin if given the ball more, and the Bills with more wins. Lets hope this coaching staff stops using him as a freaking decoy the next time they play the Patriots, and instead lets him light them up.

It means that Henderson was the only line player to grade in the positive overall at all, and it looks like C Eric Wood was the worst of the bunch. Urbik & Glenn both did get a (+0.4) in pass blocking. Henderson (+0.5) overall- Pass Blocking (+0.9) Run Blocking (-0.6) To put this grading in perspective, Cordy Glenn graded at a positive (+23.0) overall at the end of 2012 season. LG Andy Levitre also graded at a positive (+17.3) overall, and graded as PFF highest graded pass blocking guard. No Bills linemen graded in the positive for run blocking against the Jets, and that speaks volumes about the quality of the players on that line, and the coaching. I also attribute C Eric Woods poor play to the two bad OG's on either side of him, and him not being able to be comfortable enough to focus solely on his own assignments. He is a much better player then he is currently grading, as is LT Cordy Glenn. It really is kind of disheartening to realize the this HC spent his entire NFL career as a O linemen, then as an NFL O line coach, an NFL OC, and that line is the worst area of the team by far. I can't get all glowing over Urbik grading a (-0.6) overall for one performance, as I've watched this player fall on his face so many times against the better teams. IMHO upgrading both guard positions with solid players would not only immensely help in the run / pass blocking, it would also help Glenn, Wood, and Richardson along with the overall continuity a great deal. The trade deadline is today, OCT 28th, will the Bills make a move?

I have no idea what games Hackett continued to run the ball in when the score was close, as previous to the Jets game it was 40 passes vs 20 runs against San Diego, Houston, Detroit, New England, Minnesota. Up until this Jets game Hackett called more pass plays then Denver did, and less run plays. It was getting Orton sacked, hit way to often. Getting Sammy involved in the offense with Sammy getting the ball a whole 3 times the entire game. Its a credit to Watkins ability that that's all he needed. What, not a decoy this game? The games where Hackett's passing plays are effective is solely because Orton is making the proper reads, decisions, and throws. This is similar to Chan Gailey getting credit for Fitz's ability to get the ball to the open receiver so quickly. Its not like this coaching staff developed Kyle Orton whatsoever. The guy Hackett that can take credit for developing is riding the bench. I really like Kyle Orton, and the way he is winning games. Its a darn shame the Bills don't have a decent run game to help him very much. You know, kinda the same way the Cowboys run game is helping Romo.

I thought it was great watching big mouth Rex going nuts on the sidelines during the game. Now the Jests GM gave Rex an endorsement, and we all know what that means! Their bye week is 3 weeks, and after the Chiefs, Pittsburgh games. You guys think he will last past the bye if they are 1-9?

or is subject to uncontrollable impulsive behavior. Seems appropriate in doing the same thing over, and over. He must watch the game film and sees its not working, and yet comes out the next game and does it again.

For the life of me I can't understand this GM going forward with the current OG's, as both still stink even with Urbik in there. What happens if marginally better Urbik gets injured? Richardson again?

Yea, I mentioned that already. The Bills did quite good at times on first down. It was that second down run up the middle for no yards, or negative yards that screwed them. The defense knew it was coming every time, and yet... What was Albert's definition of insanity. to keep doing the same thing over, and over and expecting different results?

there was no QB coach on the team last year... No vet QB, and three rookie QB's all learning from rookie Hackett

I like him also, except for what he has done with that O line, for two years now. But then, I also liked Chan Gailey, and just dislike all the losing. It was Gailey's choices for his DC's that finally did him in, and it might be the same way with Marrone with his OC.

Great nickname, and very appropriate Hackett's Zombie offense. I like it.

I have no idea what the GM is thinking. Perhaps he thinks the Bills are in perfect position to make a strong run at the division title & playoffs. Whaley has had ample opportunity to fix the OG situation for the last two off seasons, and now throughout this season until the trade deadline ends. nada, zip, zilch, nothing. We already know Pears will fall on his face against the better teams, and Pears at RG is a disaster. I think Marrone is just a big of a problem as Hackett because he is the one that went forward this year with the O line situation. I recently noticed that Marrone is on the sidelines with a cheat sheet, and putting it up to his mouth with the offense on the field. So perhaps he is the one who called all those ineffective run, run, pass plays? I dunno about firing anyone at this time, and I don't know what possible change the team could make unless its picking up some better OG's, and that might just make their current games plan workable The only thing that worries me is that these offensive coaches will be back next year, and we fans will need to endure more of the same frustration from the offense, and more losing. With road wins against what playoff teams? What are you talking about? The Bills were soundly beaten by last years playoff teams in the Chargers, and Patriots. In case you missed it. The type of offense this team is putting on the field is unsustainable in winning games against good teams.

And I still am. Its clear that Orton, and his ten years of playing experience is allowing this team to win games despite the Bills coaches. I'm grateful that EJ is benched because now he won't be subject to the several concussions that ruined Trent Edwards career because of that horrible O line...and I thought it was bad in years past. There is still that chance that EJ can be developed in the future, but not by this offensive staff. It is clear to me at least, that Bills OC, Mr Can't Hackett doesn't have the wherewithal to develop a rookie QB in the NFL. Now i look back at that first season with 3 rookie QB's on the roster, and smile while thinking how clueless this offensive staff is, and wondering how they won any games at all. The Bills were only 20th or so on offense last season, and now they are worse. They had a sort of decent run game last year, and now they are worse. Up until the Jets game Hackett had his QB's throwing more then the Broncos, and running less then them. Just unreal! All I can say is IMO with the talent on this roster (aside from OG) a top offensive staff would probably have them contending for the division title, and playoffs no question. The type of offense this team is putting on the field is unsustainable in winning games against good teams. I think the difference in a top offensive set of coaches would be like the difference between George Edwards-Dave Wannstedt vs Pettine-Schwartz has been for the defense.

I can recall a 40 plus page thread defending Dick Jauron, and all the insanity of keeping Turk Schonert as OC right up until Ole Dickie fired him two weeks before the season opener. Then instead of reaching out to an experienced OC he promotes the QB coach again. Turk Schonert was the QB coach before Steve Fairchild left to be the HC at Colorado St, and Skeletor promoted him to OC. Bills fans were defending Chan Gailey right up until GM Buddy Nix stated he is my guy in 2014, and beyond...and then shortly after he fired him. The current offensive coaches are just plain bad, and to the current tune of #28 in the NFL bad. The O line after two off seasons is the worst in the NFL and mostly because two of the worst OG's in the league. How long should Marrone & Hackett get a pass? If not for Orton and HIS two last min drive heroics, and one with one second left on the game clock the Bills are 3-5. I suppose some fans just feel the need to defend the stupid, and hapless coaches no matter who or why. Didn't George Edwards & Dave Wannstedt have their loyal supporters too? Oh, and if Sammy Watkins can get 157 yards and a TD on only 3 catches, just think what he could have done if he caught 10. I just hope I don't have to see another year of these offensive clowns, and I also hope another team doesn't steal Schwartz.

The thing is he wasn't used in a conservative manor at all at first. His first game, Detroit 43 passes, 2 sacks, his second game. New England 38 passes, 5 sacks. His third game, 43 passes, 6 sacks. I can see that the Bills tried to run it more against the Jets in order to keep Orton from getting killed. Still, there is no excuse for the way this offense runs the ball. They ran it the exact same way with Spiller and Jackson, and the only difference being is that because CJ & Fredex are so talented they also made Mr Can't Hackett look somewhat competent. 73% of the time up the middle is ineffective, and it was almost hilarious to watch Boobie try and bounce it outside like Spiller does because there is no hole. The offense has gotten worse to #28 now, Schwartz & Orton are the bigger reasons why this team is 5-3. Please stop making excuses for these offensive loser coaches.

I didn't say I hated Can't Hackett or Marrone. What I did say is I hate that Orton is making them look competent. Why? Because these coaches suck, and now it looks like we will be stuck with them another year! This team still has major problem with penalties, and discipline. The team has had two off seasons to build the O line, and yet its graded worse then it has been in 14 years. This with a supposed O line guru at head coach. Although Pears is not much of an upgrade, why did it take six weeks to finally get Pears in at LG, and the RG is still one of the very worst in the NFL. This week the Bills beat a 1-6 bad team on the road and, Orton, 6 turnovers along with great defensive play is what won that game. It wasn't the brilliant game plan, the Bills won despite the game plan or play calls. Last week against a 2-5 team It took last second heroics by Orton to beat Minnesota with a TD with one second on the clock. The thing is the first down run game worked a lot of the time against the Jets, and then failed badly on second down over and over because the OC predictably called an up the middle run, run, then pass on third down every series. Where is the imagination, where is the ingenuity? How many times did the team get the ball with great field position mid field only to have 3 downs and out. Ya know what really sucks, is that if these morons for coaches had built a decent O line this year they easily be competing for the division title, and playoffs. On a positive note, I'm just happy to see them not using Sammy as a freaking decoy anymore.

Seriously? Ever consider that Orton is changing the play at the line into something that works? While I love Kyle Orton, I also hate that he is making Hackett and Marrone look somewhat competent. Because I highly doubt this team beats the better teams they play this year with a crap O line & run game. Both Marrone and Hackett are responsible for the play of the offense other then Orton. So many penalties. Six* turnovers helped the Bills win this game, and the 32 rushes for 67 yards with a 2.1 YPC avg didn't.