thewildrabbit

Then go back and look at some of the games those two started against, just two that I recall ....Fitz against the back up Colt players in a game where they pulled all the starters because they didn't want any getting hurt heading into the playoffs. Edwards against the Saints D and Gregg Williams constant blitzing, All the guy did all game was run for his life each play, and of course the Bills OC kept calling passing plays. Before I condem the guy I'll wait and see how he performs in Jacksonville with 1st string reps and being taught by someone that actually is an offensive coordinator

Thought for sure someone would have said ....thanks for the info nostadumbas The Bills are the worst team in he NFL, they have the worst O line in the NFL, not very difficult to predict the QB will fail against the #3 defense in the NFL

I agree, kinda sad Bills fans are like this I still don't get all the hate for this guy, all he did was try his best to win games for the Bills. Was it his fault that he was trained by morons, 4 different offensive coordinators in 4 years and only one of them a "real" coordinator and that guy bails on him after two weeks. I agree he should have been benched, seems stupid to just cut the starter after wasting an entire off season on him. I think Gailey / Nix did the guy a favor, he is now in an offense with a good TE that can block AND catch the ball, and will learn an offense from an OC who has been there more then one year. I'll bet he is happy to be a Jaguar, at least his team is 3-3

watch it on ESPN MNF

Can we trade this coach and GM...for people that know what they are doing? oh wait, The Bills still have the same owner and scouts...scrap the entire franchise and start over

The fans here deserve better then Ralph Wilson as an owner, I suppose the reason why they keep buying season tickets and going to games is the Buffalo Bills ....

Granted, Manning is that team, without him they are nothing with the worst running game in the NFL, but then who needs to run when you have Manning. On that same note put Payton Manning behind Buffalo's PoS O line and they win 7-9 games, meanwhile the QB gets the crap beaten outta him every game...how many games till end game and his career is over? Payton Manning is one of the least sacked QB's in the NFL year after year for a reason, it starts with the center Jeff Saturday, Manning can actually step up in the pocket if need be. He and Tom Brady have had some of the very best O lines over the last ten years, they actually have linemen that have been on the team for more then 2 years. This season he has a decent but not great O line and it shows, he would get killed playing behind Buffalo's line. Heh, the GM stated that the O line was a priority in last years draft, and the best he could do was Wang at #5....

Until he gets concussed or hurt, a serious injury keeps a 50 million dollar QB on the bench ....or a serious injury could even end his career and waste that money and draft pick. But ...throw caution to the wind and say F it and let him run for his life if need be Only a fool builds a team in reverse and plays Russian roulette with his superstar QB, but hey...lots of NFL teams think the same way you do.

yea, he will do better in Seattle He had a tough time finding success in Buffalo at time, then again lots of players have a tough time with the rag tag coaches this team has had for 10 years

You guys just don't get it... this team doesn't want to win... they don't want to pay anyone a high salary unless they are a fan / owner favorite and a true superstar player, and even then they might not. They wanna build cheap and slow, as long as fans keep buying tickets whats the incentive to produce a winner?

This was from tonyjustbcuz Well to answer the question that you repeatedly asked (but, I have a feeling you already know that answer)..a big part of the scouting went through the eyes and ears of Tom Modrak who has been here for the past decade..(maybe longer?)..He has insisted on certain players like Mike Williams...and when we could've had Drew Breeze in the draft, he argued with Greg Williams against selecting Drew! Greg Williams so much as said this the last time we played them, and was happy to leave the Bills mismanaged organization. The biggest blunder of all though was in the 90's when Ralph Wilson let Bill Polian slip away. Another wonderful part of the organization was when Ted Marchibroda was here. You don't here much about when he was here, but he had a lot of input in the success of the Bills. Like you mentioned, we have made so many blunders in the draft it is almost unbelievable. Bryant McKinney has been very good for Minnesota for all these years, while Mike Williams has been eating himself out of the leaugue and trying to once again stick around the leaugue for a bit. Besides drafting which is a huge issue, we also lack the initiative to resign our players that we develop during their first contract, creating more holes to fill when we have a limited amount of draft selections. How do you replace players quickly like Antwoine Winfield, Pat Williams, Jabari Greer, Leonhard, Nate Clements etc..? You end up having to use one of your draft picks or pick up a marginal free agent to fill the whole while depriving your roster from improving as all you are doing is filling holes that is self-created by management's inability to re-sign players. Buddy Nix self-admittedly believes in picking up mostly (if not always) marginal players to fill holes on the roster. He actually mentioned that when he was hired. He doesn't believe in the "big-name" signings! Well, although their are teams who annually do the big name signings without much reward: Washington Redskins (Dan Snyder)...there are also teams like New England, and the NY Jets that sign big time free agents quite well, and they have been well rewarded for doing so. So I do not buy into that philosophy at all !!! How does a team go from bottom dweller to division champion? Look at Miami... 3 key things went into that.... Drafting extrememly well, Key acquisitions in Free Agency, and adding a twist and some ingenuitive thinking as far as their offense goes! ie: Wildcat !! Unfortuantely, the Bills refuse to consider serious changes and when they do implement a significant change they shortchange themselves by utilizing undersized players in the 3-4 defensive scheme which is fruitles. Hasn't the new management of Nix and Gailey stressed the point that they were going to utilize a players talent in a way so they can best succeed? (I know they have..) Does anyone really feel that the Bills have taken even one step towards that goal in any manner??? Also, how are you doing to develop your talent (now that's a contrast in terms..Talent??) if your younger players like Maybin, Moats, Carrington, Troup are either inactive or sitting on the bench most or all of the game???? How can Ralph look anyone in the eye and say "This I promise you, we are going to fix it", when referring to the Bills? How can he speculate that it will be at worst 3 years? I don't believe you can KEEP Tom Modrak as a paid employee and, try to convince the fans that you are committed to turning this ship around!! That would be my first step....Releasing Tom Modrak! Then I'd know at least that you are serious, as symbolic as it may be! The second step is I would promote Doug Whaley within the organization who has been a big part of Pittsburgh's success in the past. Third step, I would quickly trade or release players now or at the end of the season who have been anonomous players ie: Aaron Maybin....there are others but he'd be first on my list! This may be symbolic as well, but it delivers a message that non-performers will not be on our roster! Fourth step...but maybe this step would come first as the trade deadline is Tuesday...I would make at least 3 trades, even if we don't get the better of the deal. The main thing with a build through the draft mentality is you need as many picks as you can get! We need about 6 more picks, but I'd settle for 3 more on top of the extra one we have. Do you see the Bills doing this????? No, neither do I...it's kinda like running out of bounds on 4th and whatever with 4 seconds left in the game! Why wouldn't you wing it down the field and try for a big strike??? Why wouldn't you want a heavy turnover in a rebuilding organization????????????????????????????????????????????????????//// Fifth step...Although us fans are tough...and we apply pressure to a bad organization...do not admit publicly that you are going to focusing on drafting a QB in the upcoming NFL Draft ! If I were Andrew Luck, or Ryan Mallet I'd be thinking that maybe I shouldn't declare if it means the Bills might be the team to select me next year!!!!!!! Just shutup, or admit that you need a QB (Probably 2), (one through FA), OLT, 2 WR's, DT, LB's and that we are going to address these needs! Without disclosing your specific plan!!! Just a bad organization caught in the circle of self-destruction!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was kinda hoping someone would tell me why Tom Modrak still has a job with the Buffalo Bills, how do you consistently fail in your job for 8 years and still keep it? Tom Donahoe was fired in Pittsburgh after he lost a power struggle with Bil Cowher, once Donahoe was hired here in Buffalp he hired Modrak away from Pittsburgh. They guy must have some photo's of somebody or something to keep his job, he should have been canned right along with Donahoe when he was fired years ago. How does the owner complain about the talent and then does nothing to correct the situation The problem in my view dog is that Buddy Nix made the O line a priority in the last draft and came away with Wang at #5, the guy hasn't even seen the field yet afaik. So he went into the draft and didn't see any O linemen worth selecting in the first 5 rounds? I just don't trust this staff, scouts-GM- head coach to make any decent selections at any position, I don't get how the owner can feel comfortable about them either. Perhaps he still sits in the draft room and makes some picks himself like he used to do in eariler years, that might be an answer as to why the team has no talent

Wanted to edit the above post, but it said I didn't have permission.... Anyway, Ralph Wilson keeps making the statement that the Bills just don't have the talent to compete, and yet the scouting dept keeps missing and making mistakes on selections and he takes no action against them.... What I basically wanted to know is, can we trust this staff to get it right this year?

Ok, this current Bills team for whatever reason is considered one of the worst this year and will likely finish in the top 5 worst. That means they will get a shot at a true franchise QB-LT-LB or an ultra talented player at some position. My Question is, will they get it right or screw it up like they have the last 8 years? That same scouting staff that was responsible for the LT Mike Williams pick with the 4th pick. back in 2002.....is he still in Buffalo helping them to make horrid draft choices? Is the same guy that scouted Aaron Maybin and stated he would be better then Brian Orakpo still in Buffalo? Is the same guy who drafted Donte Whitner the 56th rated player at #9, is he still with the Buffalo Bills? Is the guy who hasn't drafted a decent offensive linemen for the last 8 years, save Wood and Levitre that were taken with a #1 & # 2 pick, is he still in Buffalo? Tom Donahoe took the heat for that complete bust at tackle that got a multi-million dollar contract and was beaten out by free agent Jason Peters, but who is responsible for directing that Williams would be a worthwhile selection? How exactly can you be horrible at your job for nearly a decade and still have that job? Can Buddy Nix override the moronic scouting reports he will receive from the Bills staff, or will he be looking at the film and making his own conclusions?

We can put this to rest now: From the Buffalo news and a story by Vic Carucci Dated Feb 4th 1993 http://www.highbeam....2-22491923.html ""Buffalo Bills owner Ralph C. Wilson Jr. said that his "personal and professional differences" with Bill Polian in the last three years led to the firing of the most successful general manager in team history. In an exclusive interview with The Buffalo News, Wilson confirmed that the main reason for the dismissal was the turbulent relationship between Polian and Jeff Littmann, treasurer of Wilson's Detroit-based company. "They didn't get along well," Wilson said from his winter home in West Palm Beach, Fla. "I'm being very honest, there was some friction there. It (made for) an uncomfortable feeling on my part. And I just thought it was time to make a change and …"" P.S. Another rumor I heard while at the SB was that RW was livid at Bill Polian because his brother had a Bills playbook, or had taken one, or somehow had lost one, or somehow the opposing team had gotten hold of one. All I can remember is that Polian's brother who was in charge of team security was responsible for the missing playbook and RW was extremely pissed about the whole situation. Anyone else recall anything about this or can verify it at all?

dog your just not gonna sway the Trent haters / Fitz lovers....let the games speak for themselves. Fitz has the Ravens up next, lets see how he performs against a top defense, the thing about Fitz is that at first he looks better because he takes more chances, then when those chances start to backfire the fans want him out... just like last year when he took over for Edwards. Now that moronic Gailey is finally starting Fred Jackson he will have more success running the ball, that alone should help the offense immensely . The absence of Cornell Green should also improve by removing the revolving door penalty machine at RT, I gotta think anyone would be better at RT then Green. I stated eariler in the preseason that this years offense will score more points, have better stats and yet fail to win games because that is EXACTLY how Gailey's offense at KC preformed under Tyler Thigpin. Big Ben was recently asked how he felt to be starting again and he stated he didn't care if they won games throwing for 6 yards and scoring 6 points...as long as they won. Winning isn't everything, its the ONLY thing.

Wilson fired John Butler when he wouldn't sign an offer before the season had even ended, his statement was "If I can't hire you, I'll fire you"" I would think it would have taken more money then RW was willing to pay to keep Butler (and AJ Smith) in Buffalo. Plus I think Butler was tired of dealing with Jeff Littman as was Polian. Why in the hell would anyone with as much football acumen and smarts as Butler and Polian want to stay and deal with Ralph Wilson ( a notoriously cantankerous and cheap owner ) and his staff of clowns. I'm pretty certain now that Chuck Knox ended his time in Buffalo for mostly the same reasons Polian and Butler left only with Idiot GM Stew Barber thrown into the equation. I'm also pretty certain that Butler-Polian-Knox never looked back with any remorse about leaving the Buffalo Bills as all three ended up with more money and less crap to deal with. Knox took yet another team to the playoffs basically by himself, Polian took the Colts to a super bowl and won it, Butler (RIP) along with AJ Smith have built a new powerhouse in San Diego. Ralph Wilson is his own worst enemy, in regards to building and maintaining a winning organization

If you are completely dismissing the coaching...well then get a grip on reality, as they mostly used a 4-3 in the last game and it didn't make much difference against the run. The team has been making the transition to a 3-4 but have still used the 4-3 at various times. I can recall a year without Schobel in 2008, and yea, there was no viable pass rush just like this year, but the defense was no where near this bad. Exactly how difficult is it for the DC to call a cover 2 -cover 3 and Tampa 2 defense during a game...which is exactly what they ran in the past 4 years. The team has always been lousy at stopping the run because that is the main flaw of the Tampa 2.... just not this lousy! It is the coaching, its always the coaching

I disagree about the players, this same basic core of players played much better under Perry Fewell then they did for Jauron. This same basic group of players is playing worse for Edwards then they did for Jauron or Fewell. Lets not forget the horrendous amount of injuries Jaurons teams suffered from, this current team has lost a few for various game but not like years past where 20 guys went on IR each year. This defense is what happens when you have a guy who was an assistant LB coach last season and now asked to run an entire defense, setup play calls and game plans. Chan Gailey could have hired any number of experienced NFL assistant defensive coordinators, he chose someone with no real experience at his job, so the team suffers as this dc learns how to do his job. You can blame Edwards for his lacking the knowledge and skills to build a good defense, or you could blame the guy who hired him.

The grand plan has worked over the last ten years, keep the team on the verge of making the playoffs and sell out the stadium every game...By keeping the team on the verge of the playoffs accomplishes several things. First : it allows the team to pay only a few fan favorite semi super stars and thus keeps the player payroll under control., no 50-100 million dollar contracts on this team Second: by hiring non big named coaches and non experienced assistants it keeps the costs of the coaches and the assistants, you notice that the team usually promotes from within the org for assistants. Third: the president is the owner, he gets to collect a paycheck that he doesn't earn Fourth: the scouting dept is supposed to fail on a regular basis... if they found superstar players then they would need to pay them. This way they can pay rookie contracts and then let them walk. Fifth: the fans keep buying seats and merchandise year after year, truly devoted and exceptional fans but sadly easily misled. The plan is and has been working, the fans just don't want to see it, or believe it

You didn't answer the question, just avoided itYea well, same basic players, less injuries and the defense went from bad to horrid ... #2 against the pass last year, what changed.? what doesn't help the defense is that the offense is so intent on passing that they don't even try to run the ball or can't, which would help in every aspect, time of possession, keep the defense on the bench to keep them fresh Most everyone posting in this forum last season thought the Bills had a bad offensive line but its biggest problem was all the injuries, the only player that played in every game was the center, Hangartner. This year, without all the injuries,this line is even worse then last years, and that says a lot

Remind me again how great Fitz is after the Ravens game, then again after the Steelers game The two teams Fitz played decently against have defenses that are actually rated worse the the Buffalo Bills, if you can believe that is even possible Bills #28- NE #29- Jags #30 in total defense I like the guy, he is a gamer and can certainly run for his life better then most. He wants to win but he is just not getting enough support from his head coach to help the team win. Instead of putting him in shotgun 70% of the game build the game plan around Fred Jackson and run the ball more to setup the pass, use play action more.

Yea well, at least they won some games last year. Exactly how is this years offense better then last years?

The Jets controlled the ball for 40+ min and the Bills had the ball for19 min, that is pathetic. The thing is... the Dolphins in that first game of the season came out run blitzing and spying Spiller to take him out of the game, and then to the Dolphins surprise they found they could easily run / pass blitz and the Bills protection schemes were so bad that they couldn't stop them in any aspect. The QB had around 2 seconds or less to get rid of the ball, the RB's were getting hit in the backfield as soon as they got the hand off and were tackled for a loss on almost every running play. Spiller was the feature back and had 7 attempts for 6 yards and the longest run was 6 years. That means the RB was successful only on ONE running play. The head coach made no adjustments, no changes, he just kept trying to run his offense and throw the ball out of the shotgun formation 75% of the offensive plays. Basically telling the opponent we are going to pass, try and stop us. I know that the Dolphins game is simply that, one game, but that one game is a microcosm of what is wrong with this offense and head coach. I don't think this guy is purposely trying to lose games to get that first overall next year, although it sure looks that way to some. Go back to 2 years ago when he was the OC for the 2-14 KC Chiefs, the QB played pretty well when healthy and put up some decent stats considering how bad the offense was. That 08 KC offense played almost exactly the same way the Bills are currently playing. Like the Mike Martz passing offense it appears that Gailey's offense almost always has the QB in constant duress situations. Constantly trying to throw the ball like the Bills have Tom Brady back there behind the center. Gailey did try and run the ball more against the Packers, which at the time didn't seem to bright a ploy because that very same Packer defense was #1 against the run the year before. The Bills had some success running the ball on one drive, but then failed to move the ball on the ground on a regular basis the rest of the game, which was putting the QB under duress and in constant long yardage situations, which then put him at the mercy of that Packer pass rush and more specifically Clay Mathews. My take is this new head coach is no better then Turk Schonert or AVP in calling plays or setting up game plans, he wasn't even bright enough to see that Fred Jackson is by far the best RB on his team. Fred Jackson is so good a RB that he actually does make the O line look like its blocking better, even though the O line is actually blocking worse this season that last years. This HC is simply mentality retarded for not building the offensive game plan around the guy. Bottom line: the Bills thought they were hiring an offensive guru who was supposed to make the offense better...he didn't, it isn't !! Last season the O line had the excuse of all those Injuries, This year this team is playing worse then the Jauron's teams riddled with injuries the last 3 seasons. Even with 20+ players out injured on Jaurons teams played better then this years team, that is sad. The owner and FO keeps stating like a broken record that its the players that lack talent....he said it last year and now again this year, but who is doing the drafting? This same basic scouting dept has been there for 8 years and the same results, bad draft after bad draft. The talent is lacking on the sidelines (coaches) and in the front office (scouting dept) and an owner who remains president even after failing to get his team to the playoffs for a decade.

We can all complain on a daily basis and it won't change anything at OBD, those guys are RW's friends and buddies(pardon the pun) I suppose it will have to be good enough simply to make others aware of who the culprits are that are responsible for ten years of bad drafts and the downturn of the franchise. As pointed out It is not just the roster that needs purging. Considering the owners age, would it be wrong of me to suggest that most people at the mans age would be in a nursing / retirement home and not still be the president of a near billion dollar franchise. It all starts at the top, consider who is the president of the Colts-Ravens-Dolphins and other successful franchises. The guy owns the team, does he still need a job title in order to draw a paycheck to pay for his health care and hobbies? I suppose that title gives him complete control over the team and he still makes all the important decisions. If he truly cared about his team and his fans he would release his Al Davis like deathgrip on the team. I honestly hope the man lives to be 110 or older, I would just like to see him to hand the team over to a proven football person like Ozzie Newsome- Bill Polian- Bill Parcells type who can actually lead the franchise into a winning era.