thewildrabbit

In order for both of them to get 1000 yards each the Buffalo Bills play caller would need to start calling more running plays. Last year after Freddy went on IR it looked like the Bills play caller was just running the ball as a diversion now and then as the Bills were in constant shotgun and throwing most of the games NY Jets Fitz 26 /39 vs 19 carries Spiller Tenn Fitz 29 / 46 passing vs 14 carries for Spiller SD Fitz 13 /34 vs Spiller 12 carries Miami Fitz 31 / 47 vs Spiller 12 carries Denver Fitz 15 / 27 vs Spiller 16 carries NE 29 /46 vs Spiller 13 carries That is pretty lame considering the Bills had ONE decent WR in the top20 in Stevie Johnson who was 18th best WR in the NFL with 76 receptions, the next was David Nelson at 41st.

NFN, but In your first post you came out stating that because Eli Manning has the most QB pressures on him he plays behind the worst O line in the NFL. Then you state because the Bills line allowed some of the fewest sacks they have one of the best O lines, and the Bills QB is the problem. Even after I, and others gave clear evidence to you that the stats don't always tell the true story. Evidence that showed that Eli has some of the best O linemen in the league, that the Bills have some of the worst O linemen in the league, that the Bills QB isn't nearly as bad as you make him out to be. You still hold to the beliefs that stats must be the word of god. I can understand that you feel the need to defend your post, but to blindly stand behind statements that are clearly more then moronic shows what type of person the fans in this forum will need to deal with. You don't like Fitz, we get it. NFL stats put out by pro football focus and other sites are the word of god to you, and you can't be shown any different. Moron is a pretty harsh word, but someone who states that an article isn't any good because it was a few months old is a moron in my view. In my first post in this thread I welcomed you. I take that welcome back I feel sorry for someone that can't get over their player hate long enough to open their mind to what the truth is. You won't even take the word of an NFL player over your own thinking. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, thank you for clarifying what that is so I can avoid entering into other discussions with you.

Yea, well stated Not to mention to the OP that Mayock is also an announcer for games and probably hadn't delved into player analysis until recently

IMHO just go with Mike Mayock, he isn't perfect but I trust what he says over any other player analyst.He used to play in the NFL and relies on what he see's on game tape over any other factor. Several NFL teams have tried to hire him away from the NFL network to head their scouting dept and he turned them down. The biggest difference between him and actual team scouts is he doesn't dig into the players personnel background as much as a top scout would. Interviewing ex coaches, their friends and teammates and family. You would be surprised to see the depths that some teams go thru when looking into a player background for a first round pick.

Exactly right, Spiller was all Chan Gailey. In retrospect I wonder If Gailey still picks Spiller, or drafts JPP or an OT that year, or a TE Gronkowski 2nd round - Graham 3rd round Even looking at last season with all those 4-5 WR sets I gotta wonder if he would rather have drafted AJ Green. stating that the Bills could have even drafted Andy Dalton as they picked before Cincy in round 2. But then I still gotta question the talent level in the Buffalo Bills scouting dept that missed on so many in that 2010 draft I could, and usually do every chance I get. The problem is with both the HC who wanted Spiller very badly, and the GM who did care to trade back and get more picks plus a player who could have made an immediate impact that season. But then looking at the entire 2010 Bills draft not one player became an immediate starter and made an impact that year

It wasn't just the laptop, there was a bunch of things in his past that bothered many people,. plus don't forget Vince Young (head case) Michael Vick (dogs) I had him pegged wrong also. The kid looked amazing his first year and set some records as a rookie, he looks to be the best QB since Stafford. Kind of a shame he was overshadowed by Tim Tebow most of the year in the media or we would have heard so much more about him His story isn't fully written yet tho, who knows what will happen the next few years. He still needs to show he can take his team to the playoffs. If he can't, then he needs to show he can handle the frustration of not winning if they don't rebuild that team properly and he doesn't make the playoffs quickly. -------------------------------- As for trading up for RG3 or Luck, no way! This team still has way to many holes to even consider drafting a rookie QB....who wouldn't survive behind that current line. Per Buddy Nix: Pass rusher, the lack of a decent pass rush dragged down the entire defense. (one -two pass rushers) WR, they need to re sign Stevie Johnson PLUS adding one or two more receivers after they sign Stevie, grab a free agent like Vincent Jackson- Dwayne Bowe . then add another WR in the draft (2-3 WR's) He stated he plans to draft an OT in this draft, and he also stated a team can't have enough DB's Sounds like a plan

Not only that, then they got screwed again this year when both Matt Barkely AND Landry Jones decided to return to college for another year. Luck would have gone to Carolina, the owner there had him in his sights 100%. Then he actually got on the phone with Luck to ask if the reason he decided to return for another year at Stanford was because the Panthers had the first pick. The Panthers were very iffy about Newton at first. P.S. I recently read an article that the Buffalo Bills FO -HC- scouting dept- is not very secretive about what players they covet the most in the draft. Might be a reason why they lose out on players like Cam Newton, Von Miller and others

One guy is often injured, the other guy drops passes in big games may be the thinking by this FO / owner, who really knows what this ball club will do. I can't see them using the franchise tag on either at 10 mill per... All I know is that the guy behind Stevie Johnson (19th ) was the 61st WR last year in Donald Jones, which doesn't bode well for Chan Gailey and his 4-5 WR sets

The thing is.... Mike Mayock states when he watches someone really step up at the combine and wow everyone with the numbers...then he goes back and watches more game film. Mostly to make certain this prospect isn't just a workout warrior. Should the game film equal the combine performance then that player will move up the draft board. If it doesn't, then the player doesn't move up on Mikes board.

Yea, NOW they would! Not so many before the draft were that high on Newton. Don't forget he was graded as the 10th best player. ESPN had him at 15th It was Nevergiveup who stated the Bills would go after Newton before the draft. Nix and Gailey only mentioned it just after the draft from what i recall.

I get the distinct impression that the Bills don't like to pay top dollar to 7th round draft picks....players that they took the time to develop over the years. Which makes no sense to me unless Johnson is asking for the farm, or is thinking he will get franchised @ 10 million a year. If they don't sign Johnson they go into this next season with a WR who was ranked 61st in David Nelson

All good points that not many here simply don't get. First, both Buddy Nix and Chan Gailey have both openly stated that if Cam Newton had been available to the Bills last season at #3 they would have drafted him....OK! They realize that Fitz is a serviceable journeyman QB that can get the Bills to a winning season if he has enough talent around him. Even the Buffalo Bills owner Ralph Wilson acknowledged this point. I agree that the edges of the current O line are weak, not to mention that you can't win games with the starters not playing. the Bills need more stability at LT for certain. Bell has shown flashes that he can be a good LT, but he can't stay healthy. .. 31 out of 48 in 3 years. it remains to be seen if they will re sign him. The center position also has to be a worry, with Eric Wood in there the line played significantly better 10-14-9, 33 out of 48 in 3 years. The bills had no depth at LT or center and were in serious trouble when injuries hit those positions. That Bills line still has several questions to be answered this off season. I can't emphasize enough how import it is to have more then one decent WR threat. Many in this thread were comparing Fitz to Eli and its such a lame comparison when the Giants had the #3 & #12 WR's. Stevie Johnson was #19, David Nelson was #61. In comparison the Patriots had Welker at #2 and Rob Gronkowski at #6. Then looking at the plays the Bills called all season long with those 4-5 WR sets and only having one decent WR....which made no sense to me. P.S. "'He basically thinks that # of starts equates to performance. It doesn't."" I never made that statement. What I have been doing is complaining about the O line for years to anyone who would listen. I can understand making the trade with Jason Peters, i just don't understand not properly replacing him. What Ive been trying to say is for O line players "continuity" means a great deal. The thing is.... the longer an O line plays together the better they become, that is just a fact of football. Call it chemistry, cohesiveness, continuity or whatever you like. Its important in all aspects of a team it just seems more so for the O line to know and trust what the man next to you is going to do in every situation. One miss step, one wrong move and the QB is hit, sacked or even concussed and knocked out of the game. Its not just one on one in the trenches, your 5 gotta know what to do against their 5 or it could be game over very fast. Most of this fan base just doesn't realize how lucky this team is to have a QB like Fitz who can get that ball out in under 3 seconds. It made this team competitive in many games this year. Is he a Payton Manning- Drew Brees-Eli Manning? I honestly don't know yet...and neither do all of the rest of you, and we won't know until he has a decent O line that allows him the time to throw 5-7 step drop back deep passes. A WR corps with more then one good player, and players that can actually catch the ball most of the time. a good TE that can play all 16 games

This guy kinda reminds me of " Paintmyhouse" and his hellbent crusade against Fitz last offseason. Never mind the fact that the same place where he gets all his stats and facts from (pro football focus) states that Fitz is the 8th best QB in the league in avoiding sacks

I like how you ignore a lot of what I said and focus on just the Giants O line and Eli Manning and his supposed ability to get the ball out faster then any other NFL QB. OK Well, lets talk about this supposed fact that Eli Manning gets the ball out faster then any other QB in the NFL. Are you referring to his release or his ability to find the open receiver and get him the ball once the ball is snapped? Manning might get more pressures simply because his game plans call for him to take deeper drops, like way more 5-7 step drops then the Bills utilize. Now I won't argue that Fitz isn't that quick in his delivery. Even Trent Edwards was timed by ESPN as one of the fastest QB's in the NFL at getting the ball out once he started the throwing motion. Now we all know the difference between Fitz and captain check-down. Ryan Fitzpatrick has an uncanny ability to find the open receiver and get him the ball in about 3 seconds or under. If you don't believe me ....will you believe NY Giants DE Osi Umenyiora when he stated such in an article by ex Giant Chris Canty ""The Giants' pass rush won't necessarily surrender Sunday, but it will change tactics. Big Blue has piled up 11 sacks since Umenyiora's Week 4 return, but isn't likely to get many against Buffalo. On average, Fitzpatrick fires the ball just 1.5 seconds after taking the snap, Umenyiora said. On set plays," Umenyiora said, "nobody can get to him." Here is a link to an article by ESPN, and note that it was written when Eric Wood / Dem Bell were still healthy .. QB The team that takes the shortest amount of time to throw is the Buffalo Bills. Fitzpatrick, also a top-10 quarterback according to Total QBR, has to get the ball out so quickly because Buffalo's offensive line is the second-worst in the league at allowing pass pressure within three seconds in the pocket. Long winded rant?.... I'm trying to point out to you how important the term "continuity" is and the difference between players that only play 7 games a season vs players that play 16 games year in and year out since they started. David Diehl primarily plays guard and was kicked out to LT when the injuries hit that Giants O line. Unlike the Bills, the Giants were able to pull it together and give Manning the time to make most of his throws. The Bills tried to move Levitre to LT and it was an unmitigated disaster and had to move him back to guard. Diehl OTOH stayed at LT and played well enough all the way thru the season and SB. You are trying to state that the Bills don't need a LT, which is complete BS. Even if they retain Bell he is a "maybe player" compared to those NY Giant players that DON"T MISS GAMES! The rookie Hairston did a decent job considering he usually only had to hold his blocks for 3 seconds, but he needs more experience and also needs to stay healthy as he missed time last year due to injuries. Should the Bills decide not to re sign Bell then they are in deep poop because they need more stability and depth at LT then just Chris Hairston.

Stating that the NY Giants have the worst O line in the NFL because they allowed 244 pressures this season is kinda lame. Stats don't mean much when you look at both teams closely. There is so much difference between the two different teams (Bills-Giants) The players, the schemes and plays that are called. The Bills mostly utilize a short passing game, and depend on getting the ball out very quickly which can skew the stats into looking better then they really are. Look at the amount of games played by the Giants O linemen this year and the last few years to understand the concept of "continuity". Look how many game starts their players have had over the last 5 years vs the Buffalo Bills O line to understand the reasoning behind the as to why having solid healthy good players is so important to having a good team. Lets look at that NY Giants O line. NY Giants David Diehl is a guard who was kicked out to LT this year because of an injury to the starter and it worked for them because the guy has been on the team since 2003 and basically played almost 16 games every year since he started in 03. (a great player) HE IS A PRO BOWLER (one time) The guy might have been a 5th round pick but he has definitely played like a top draft pick over his career. 140 games played 140 game starts is amazing RG Chris Snee, a guard and 2nd round pick has been with the team since 2004. another player who has played almost 16 games every year since he was drafted HE IS A PRO BOWLER (three time) 120 games played, 120 games starts is amazing RT Kareem Mckenzie, an 11 year vet that was drafted in the 3rd round by the jets and joined the Giants in 2005. Look at this players history of starts since joining the Giants, missing only 7 games in 7 years. 161 games 153 starts C David Baas one year for the Giants and 2nd round pick of the 49ers in 2005, 11 games played 11 games started. G Kevin Boothe 16 games-9 game starts who took over for starting G William Beatty 10 G-10 GS, a 2nd round pick of the Giants in 2009. The Giants had some injuries on that O line this season and that may be the reason for the 9-7 season The Giants O line is superior to anything the Bills have fielded since the 1990's. Snee and Diehl are both pro bowlers that are lock downs at their positions Talk about continuity, the Giants QB has been in the same system-scheme under the same HC and OC since Eli Manning was drafted as the first overall pick in the 2004 draft. Comparing the bills to the Giants might have been somewhat valid in week 6 when they played against each other this year, they did play a close game 27-24. But once the injuries hit the Bills there was no comparison. Unlike the Giants who had some decent depth for their O line. The Buffalo Bills had no answer for the center position once Eric Wood went on IR. They tried 4 guys at center including G Andy Levitre and it was a horrid move. So GM Nix was forced to find warm bodies off the street to fill in on that line and for the WR position. Levitre also tried filling in at LT when both Bell and rookie Hairston were out injured. This was another move that didn't work out so well for the Bills. Fitz played on a bad team with a crazy amount on injuries to some key players. O line, WR, TE. The Bills had ONE decent WR ranked 19th , the Giants have 3 top WR's that actually catch everything even thrown remotely close to them. Victor Cruz was the #3 WR in the league with 82 receptions,1536 yards-Hakeem Nicks was the 12th rated WR with 76 receptions, 1192 yards. Now consider the coverage teams will run on those players, is it easier to roll coverages to one WR or to 3? The QB isn't the biggest problem with this team, even the FO and owner acknowledged that fact. The line needs better players who can stay healthy, and some depth. They need a pass rush and a defense like the Giants have. They need better LBers to stop the run. They need some WR's and a TE who can stay healthy. P.S. whats kinda funny is that the site you link where you got the stats from considers Ryan Fitzpatrick the 8th best QB in the league in avoiding sacks which is pretty darn good considering the talent around him. http://www.profootba...1-quarterbacks/

Welcome aboard. After week 5 during last season someone made a post of how good the bills O line was doing because of how few sacks the O line was giving up, plus the YPC Fred Jackson was getting. While the stats looked impressive they weren't telling the actual truth. This thread turned into a very heated debate about just how good that Bills line was playing last year. First HC Chan Gailey recognizing that the O line was made up of some young players, cast offs from the waiver wire, and some decent players he knew he needed to help the QB as much as he could. So he set up a short, quick passing game that would allow the QB to get rid of the ball very quickly, thus negating most of the pass rush. In doing this it also limited what plays the Bills could run in the passing game, mostly short quick passes and not so many deep passing plays. Former Bills WR Lee Evans was known for being primarily a deep threat so his talents were no longer essential to the success of the offense, another reason why he was traded away. Next you have Gailey utilizing a "spread offense", you know the very same one that Thurman Thomas run so well out of back in the early 90's. This offensive scheme kept teams from stacking the proverbial box against the run and allowed more big gains once the RB broke free. Then you have Ryan Fitzpatrick who has an uncanny ability to read the defense, call protections and then find the open receiver in 3 seconds or under once the ball is snapped. The latter part of that last statement was something that former Bills QB's JP Losman & Trent Edwards couldn't always do, but then they had some inexperienced OC's trying to call 5-7 step drop back deep passing plays when the line clearly wasn't giving them enough time to complete those throws. Here is a link to that thread I spoke of: http://forums.twobil...ine-in-the-nfl/ What really screwed this team hard this past year was the injuries on the O line, particularly at LT and center . Once Eric Wood went down and went on IR the line play really fell off, the Bills had 4 different players trying to fill that position, and none came even close to what Wood was able to do. Not only did Andy Levitre play guard but he was also used at LT and center. Both starting LT Dem Bell and rookie Chris Hairston were injured at the same time. The O line last season was a cluster fluck for the 4th straight year. Two years ago it was the RT position and center, the bills were pulling guys off the street to play RT. Then the injuries to the WR corps and Freddy Jackson also took its toll. The Bills had one viable top WR last year in Stevie Johnson, and it showed when the Bills kept trying to run 4-5 WR sets. Bell has started at LT the last 3 years, and played in 31 out of 48 games 8 his first year, 16 last year and 7 this year. Who knows if the Bills really want to resign a player so often injured. If not then this becomes a very high priority in the draft since there are no top LT's in free agency Then in regards to the QB, first I doubt there are many QB's in this league who could have even survived last season much less played as well as he did when everyone was healthy. Lets not forget that he was looking really good while that short passing game was working, and before all the injuries. Is he a top ten QB, we won't know until the Bills get him some help in protections and on the line. The Bills have so many other dire needs at other positions besides QB.

New spin on an old story... The Texans? http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/13/report-peyton-may-be-interested-in-playing-for-the-texans/ http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?section=news/sports/pro/football&id=8542447 maybe positioning himself to let the Colts owner know what could happen should he let Manning go? or sweet revenge on the Colts owner "IF" he lets him walk

Like the anonymous announcement from the team that they were willing to spend 10 million on a coach and even spoke with Bill Cowher, Mike Shanahan....then hired Chan Gailey Although some people in the front office actually try and do things to help, its just to bad that their myopic view is so distorted that when they do spend money in free agency it doesn't work. Signing T.O. for big bucks for example, he wasn't really worth the money spent in regards to his effort on the field, and that really wasn't his fault either as he came to Buffalo thinking he could accomplish something. Its the same thing for Vincent Jackson, Dwayne Bowe, DeSean Jackson or Mike Wallace who all the fans are clamoring for. The Bills need to upgrade that O line, and should they fail to do that for a 3rd straight year they will continue to keep their position at or near the bottom of the division. The T.O. experiment failed because the QB's didn't have the time in the pocket to always get the ball to the man. LT Bell showed promise when he managed to get on the field this year, but the problem is that wasn't very often as he was injured so much. Once center Eric Wood went on IR the team really went into the ceramic convenience as the Bills had no adequate backup center. The Bills had problems with the O line for the second year under this regime. They keep trying to use scotch tape and band-aids on one of the most important areas of the team.

It doesn't matter as he will be gone by the time Buffalo picks at 10th. the combine isn't even here and he is already moving up on everyone's boards. Top pass rushers are next after QB's

Naa, Irsay wants to throw Dwight Freeny in the package with Manning because he is such a nice guy.

That statement is about the furthest from the truth I've ever read. unconditionally is used to describe the love between parents and children, not sports fans and their respective teams. As a matter of fact its more a love / hate relationship from every fan I've ever known Fans have a right to B word and complain, vent their passions and frustrations in forums like this one. ten years man....TEN YEARS MAN! Bills fans have more then their share of frustrations to vent about and more then enough reasons to be skeptical. The Redskins fans are far better off IMO, at least their foolish owner goes way overboard on spending trying to build a winner. Whereas this owner lets loose his three headed monster to control and restrict what the GM and HC can do in terms of obtaining free agents and holding on to established vets.

NFL network had a doctor on who specializes in the type of neck surgery Manning had done. This doc has done 120 of these surgeries a year for the last 20 years. In regards to nerve regeneration he stated that if the injury is recovering progressively Manning should ultimately recover, but it could take up to 2 years. Manning is starting to practice and "his' doctors cleared him to practice.Once he does fully recover he shouldn't have any lasting trouble again with the same injury, in other words he should be fine and have the same chance of another neck injury as any other NFL player. This all boils down to the Colts owner not wanting to pay Manning the 28 million due him. I know its a what have you done for me lately league, but c'mon man. 10 years in the playoffs, 4 time league MVP, one SB win, one SB loss. Plus the world saw how inept that team is without Manning,after all it was built around him. It would seem smarter to me to keep Manning in case Luck stinks it up. But then the Colts have some real salary cap problems as Freeny alone is set to make 14 mill this year. NFN, but I hope Luck does fall on his face. Peter King (SI) states he thinks the Jets will make a big run at Manning just like they did with Brett Favre. The Jets will have no qualms about paying Manning top dollar, unlike other teams I know...

So many Bills players to re sign and everyone thinking this team will go nuts spending on free agancy...Mario Williams- Vincent Jackson. When I see it, I'll believe it.

Interesting article, talks about what everyone is STILL speculating about http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2012/2/9/2786781/peyton-manning-rumors-free-agency-indianapolis-colts Should pursue him: Dolphins, Jets, Browns, Broncos, Chiefs, Redskins, Cardinals and Seahawks Makes some sense but unlikely to happen: Bills, Ravens, Titans, Jaguars, Cowboys, Vikings, Bucs and 49ers. BUFFALO BILLS:" They make sense in the fact that Manning would drastically improve their team (like he would do with a lot of teams). But it takes two to marry which means not only would the Bills have to be interested but Manning would have to be interested in Buffalo. I don't see that happening". Not to mention the WR corps stinks, the O line stinks! The only part of this marriage that might be feasible is that the HC- play caller loves to call plays like he has Peyton Manning behind center. Frankly, I just don't see Manning coming to Buffalo of his own accord...unless the owner offered him part of the team...maybe. looking more and more like the Dolphins...

At the start of last year it looked like the Bills would have to many WR's, and be forced to cut someone decent. But then by the end of the year they were pulling guys off the street trying to make that 4-5 WR empty backfield set work. I'd certainly take the guy back, even at this stage of his career he has got to be better then the current #2 WR on the roster...Brad Smith...or how about Ruvell Martain, Kamar Aiken, Naaman Roosevelt, Derak Hagan? This team still hasn't signed Stevie Johnson...