thewildrabbit

It really is sad that so many fans mostly blame the players for the lost decade 2000-2012. They all love to hate their favorite hated player, JP Losman, Trent Edwards, ( it must be the lousy QB that is the reason for losing, if only we had a franchise guy....right? ) Poz, Whitner, Lynch, Jason Peters, Dem Bell. While a select few blame the head coaches and the GM, or lack of a real GM. Meanwhile the real culprit sits calmly in a different city watching his team make a sweet profit year after year... all the while not caring that his team is at the bottom of the division for 12 straight years. It still amazes me that this owner managed to be the wizard behind the curtain pulling all the strings, and yet all the fans blame everyone but him. Really, seriously..Steve Young? Steve Young sat on the bench behind Montana (87-90) while being coached up by perhaps the greatest, most innovative, brightest offensive mind the NFL has ever seen in Bill Walsh. get a grip and try again.

I wouldn't call a QB who has never even had a winning season in his 7 year career successful, try again.

The Bills have been bad for a decade or more. Bad teams usually are the result of a bad GM, bad coaching, bad teams, bad drafts and generally bad decisions all around. I'd say that typifies the time since John Butler and Wade Phillips were fired. While not inferring anything... I stated that both Losman and Edwards were starting to look like they might be able to turn that corner and become decent QB's, Instead both regressed under bad coaching. Not everyone here agrees that it was the bad coaching. You for instance are stating they both sucked and no coaching would have improved either. Name me one NFL QB who has had bad coaching in his career and became successful despite the bad coaching!

Sure, JP had Sam Wyche for 2 years. But then he had 2 different head coaches, 3 different OC's and as many QB coaches over the next few years. How many game plans was he required to absorb and learn? Not to mention losing his confidence again and again as Mularkey benched him for Kelly Holcomb. Then Jauron benching him for Trent Edwards. Trent Edwards was in the same position only worse, he never even had a decent QB coach or OC his entire time in Buffalo. All he ever had was a wanna be ex OC of the ram who never called plays or set up the game plans, and that was all of one year. Schonert and AVP should have never been allowed to become OC's, and the result was two failed QB's. Not to mention the bad head coaches, bad assistant coaches and general bad O lines and bad teams around them I don't blame the players for the Bills lack of success over those years, I blame the coaching, or lack thereof, and ownership for failing to have a proper GM / President. As for Rob Johnson, he had much better team around him at first, and a better opportunity to succeed with Wade Phillips as HC, Joe Pendry as OC. Many stars of the 90's still with the Bills in his first 2 years. I think this sorta accurately shows what can happen when you hire a lame HC and he in turn hires lame assistants. From 11-5 and playoffs under Phillips in 1999 to 3-13 in 2001under Gregg Williams At the end of 2000 Wilson fired HC Wade Phillips, and he also fired GM John Butler in December of 2000. So Tom Donahoe brought in Gregg Williams as his HC and Williams in turn hired world renowned OC Mike Sheppard....who? WTH, is Mike Sheppard? google him to see he only had 2 years previous experience as an OC under HC Kevin Gilbride 97-98, lord only knows what he did in 1999. Sheppard was OC of the Saints for one year in 2005, and has spent his recent years as WR & QB coach for different teams. Lets face it guys, the Bills have been a joke since RW fired Wade Phillips, and John Butler. Arguing over which QB was the worst over the last decade is kinda moot when you consider the teams and coaches around them

My point exactly as to why both Losman and Edwards failed to develop. The Bills lame OC's tried to force both QB's to throw mid to deep passes when neither usually had the time in the pocket required to throw those deep passes. To the last bolded line: No they don't, not all by themselves! The successful ones who adapt usually have some good to great coaching behind them early in their careers. Like I stated earlier in this thread, show me a great QB and I'll show you a great coach behind them.

Just wanted to add...Trent Edwards played his college ball at Stanford where he ran the west coast offense. Leave it to the Buffalo Bills coaches under Jauron to fit a round peg into a square hole and try and force a new QB to try and learn the Mike Martz passing offense 2nd hand from people that didn't even know how to their own jobs properly as OC's in Schonert and AVP! Is it any wonder why the kid failed so badly in Buffalo? The Eagles run a type of west coast offense under Andy Reid. If Edwards should ever have a chance to resurrect his NFL career, and rebuild his confidence it will be under Reid in Philly.

no dude, final score was 10-15 Once Chan decided to open up the playbook out of desperation and run a spread offense in the second half the Bills drove right down the field and scored and it was 13-10. then the Bills long snapper hiked it outta the back of the end zone for a safety. (i can't believe I'm agreeing with pmh) But, Chan Gailey was horrible in that game, and so was Edwards O line. Cornell Green made his first start and couldn't hold a block to save his life. The Bills couldn't run the ball either, 17 attempts for 50 yards. That team did stink, 0-8 to start the season, the ONLY bright spots were the play of Fitz and Stevie Johnson, and Freddy

So nice to be a Bills fan with selective memory and only remember the bad plays... There were times in both JP Losmans and Trent Edwards careers were they both looked like the could develop into the "real deal" and become a top QB. 2007 for JP and 2009 for Edwards. Instead of developing further they both regressed badly because no player can develop himself! Not only did both those QB's lack coaching, they played for morons who didn't know how to do their own respective jobs! Like one poster mentioned, they both played on some bad teams, bad coaching,with bad O lines. If given the chance of developing like Kyle Boller did with the Baltimore Ravens, and failing. Then it leaves no doubt about the lack of skill and talent to even develop. The only thing Jaurons staff of buffoons managed to do was teach Losman and Edwards how to run for their lives, and make poor decisions. Players are only as good as their coaching. Now, if any of you would think that Peyton Manning did it all by himself, you're wrong! Manning had Tom Moore (50 years in coaching) as his OC for 10 years who taught him to call his own plays. Same with Jim Kelly, Bills OC Ted Marchibroda taught Kelly to call his own plays. You remember Ole Ted, the ex head coach of the Colts and QB Bert Jones mentor before joining The Buffalo Bills. There was a reason Jim Kelly developed so profoundly into a 4x super bowl QB, he had some great coaching! Not to mention playing on some really good teams with good O lines.Show me a great player and I'll show you some great coaching behind him.

Good post After listening to what Fitz had to say about his QB coaching prior to this off season and the hiring of a new QB coach, and how that previous QB coaching was so lacking in helping him develop in any way shape or form...only morons of Jaurons caliber slam the Bills QB's who were forced to play for Jauron ...that complete offensive tool. The Bills OC's under the moron Jauron- Steve Fairchild who wasn't that bad, but was only with the bills one year. The men who followed after him in Turk Schonert and AVP had no business being offensive coordinators for any NFL team. Want proof? AVP is still in the NFL as a QB coach. Turk Schonert is no longer employed in the NFL in any capacity, he has been coaching in the UFL as QB coach. How on earth can anyone expect QB's to develop properly without the proper coaching. This is the main reason why Jauron failed so badly as a head coach I'm happy for Trent Edwards, if anyone can resurrect his NFL career it will be Andy Reid who is renowned at fixing broken QB's. But what does that tell you about Vince Young?

I'm still waiting to see if this line can hold their blocks effectively longer then 2-3 seconds for the mid to deep pass plays on a consistent basis. Not just now and again while trying to use smoke and mirrors. The last two years the Bills have utilized mostly a short quick passing scheme, and Fitz has an uncanny ability to get the ball to the open receiver in 2-3 seconds. Which has helped make the O line look like it is a top ten unit with so few sacks. The reality is the the offense needs to utilize the entire playbook to become completely efficient. Meaning the offense needs to have a deep passing game to keep the defense from crowding the line to stop the short passing game, and run game. I'm hoping Glenn is the answer at LT, and that Wood can stay healthy this year.

Everybody agreeing about injuries.... yet the Packers had 16 players on IR the year they won the SB, 11 of them on defense! Its all about depth, and the coaches ability to have EVERYONE ready to play. The Bills screwed themselves last season by cutting some key backups, and trading away others. Then the worst part of last season for me was watching the 2nd half of last year and the supposed QB guru call pass play after pass play when he had an injured QB! Chan Gailey didn't have Drew Brees or Tom Brady as his QB, and yet he kept calling pass plays like he did. The O line lost some key players to injuries and that didn't slow down the pass play calling one bit, in fact they Bills passed more often after Wood went on IR. Not to mention the experienced slot WR went on IR and the bills were left with scrubs behind Stevie Johnson. That didn't stop the Bills OC / HC from calling 4-5 WR empty backfield sets tho....with only one decent WR. Gailey wasn't fooling anyone with those play calls. The Bills best players on offense are Fred Jackson, Stevie Johnson, and CJ Spiller if the coaches ever decide to utilize him full-time. Once Fred Jackson went on IR Spiller never saw 20 carries in any one game, the Bills just failed to build any sort of steady ground game. Shoot, even when the Bills were dominating running the ball, the OC would just keep forcing an injured QB to try and win the games. Spiller had a 5.2 Yards Per Carry average and that was mostly over the last 6 games of the year. Fred Jackson was even better with a 5.5 YPC avg. Pure and simple the Buffalo Bills didn't run the ball enough last season, not in any situation. 1) Injuries, lack of depth 2) play calling, game planning 3) horrendous defense, trying to run a 3-4 without the proper players for it. 4) no pass rush. Bottom line: it falls on the head coaches shoulders to have everyone ready to play, even the backups. The Bills game plan went out the window the 2nd half of last year once the Bills got behind in the score, even by as little as 3 points. I would have never thought that a HC with as much game experience as Gailey has would fall into the trap of trying to constantly throw into the teeth of a defense when the opponent has the lead. I watched Jaurons inexperienced OC's Turk Schoernt and AVP do the very same thing previously to Gailey

Its so easy to be overly optimistic this year... The Bills now have a proven DC calling the plays who has a history of running a 4-3 defense to the playoffs. The Bills just added one of the best, if not the best pass rusher in the NFL. Not to be content with adding one pass rusher, the Bills stole another one away from the Patriots to add to the lineup. We are hearing Merrimen might finally be recovered from his achilles problems. This years defense should go from around 26th in total defense, 19th in pass defense, 28th in rush defense to top ten. Just think if the NY Giants who were 27th in total defense, 29th in pass defense, 19th in rush defense during the regular season can step up and play great in the post season to win the SB ...mostly with that dominating pass rush. The Bills have a chance have a solid shot to dominate all year if they can stay healthy. The offense got better with the addition of a new LT and speed WR. The QB's finally have a coach who can teach them proper fundamentals and technique. It will all come down to injuries and depth.

I agree with that statement, should the Bills get behind in the score is Gailey gonna go all out crazy trying to constantly pass like he did last year? The best offensive player on the team is Fred Jackson, no question. Fred needs to get at least 25 touches a game, every game. The second best player is Stevie Johnson and he needs his targets as well. A huge drop off in talent after those two, IMO! Unless Gailey starts utilizing Spiller more, with 4.27 speed you would think this kid would be involved in every offensive play somewhere. Fitz IS NOT Tom Brady or Drew Brees and shouldn't be forced to shoulder the entire game. Gailey needs to build a running game and work it like he did the passing game the last two years. 2 out of the best players on offense are RB's... workem Chan!

No offense, but it was exactly the opposite in my view. Chan's play calling was for quick short passes that teams were able to defend by the CB's crowding the line and bumping the receivers out of their routes. What made the running game more successful last year then in the past was the use of the spread offense so that the safeties couldn't "stack the box'" or they could easily get beaten by long runs. The 90's Bills used that same spread offense to allow Thurman Thomas to gain so many yards. It wasn't so much the no huddle that killed teams as the spread formation that allowed the more open running lanes. In my view Gailey is a blithering idiot for forcing an injured QB in Fitz to try and win games by constantly throwing and playing catch up rather then building a running game and making it work. I had thought that Gailey would do things differently then his predecessors in Turk Schonert and AVP, but he didn't. After week 8 things looked eerily similar to what we all saw on offense in 09-08 once the team fell behind in points. If you look at the thread discussing the new QB coach and the way he is teaching proper technique to Fitz it sheds some light on why Fitz is stating that now, this off season he is finally getting proper training from a QB coach that he never received in the past. This kinda speaks volumes about what Chan Gailey didn't himself teach Fitz in 2010-2011*, the supposed QB guru. *EDIT

C'mon man, Choice played in 6 for the Bills, but 28 attempts for 75 yards doesn't even equal one good game. That is a 3.0 YPC avg vs the 5.2 avg Spiller was getting. I don't know what games you were watching but Spiller was way better then Choice in every aspect from what I saw. I think the ONLY reason this guy Choice was picked up at all and given a chance by the bills is because he played some college ball at GT with Gailey as HC, just IMO. I think when you keep giving the ball to one back they are able to get into a better rhythm with the more carries they get. In those 6 games Spiller started he didn't even get 20 carries in any one game...NOT ONCE in one game because the coaches were so enamored trying to throw the ball every offensive play. Freddy OTOH had some games with 26 attempts. In his first start against the Jets he sucked big time, but that could be because up until week 11 he only had 21 attempts, and had barely played RB at all up until that point. My point is Spiller may never reach his potential as a Buffalo Bills because this HC likes to constantly throw, even when its not working. http://espn.go.com/n...3203/cj-spiller

Spiller might have a college degree, but he only scored a 10 on his "wonderlic" Which seem kind of crazy considering most players are coached endlessly about what to expect from that test and the combine overall. So it begs the question, he he just plain stupid or didn't give a damn about the test enough to actually study for it. Either way it makes him look bad. The kid does possess* 4.27 speed which is amazingly fast by NFL standards and he should have been utilized way more often the last two years then he has been. Look to blame the coaches for not getting this kid on the field more. Even when he started after Jackson went out on IR in week 8. in 2011, 16 games, 11 starts and he averaged 5.2 YPC, and yet only saw 107 attempts for 561 yards. I watch the last half of last season and the coaches seemed determined to make an injured QB constantly throw all game long while they have a RB with a 5.2 YPC avg. BTW that 5.2 YPC avg is what Jim Brown retired with! Barry Sanders had a 5.0. Eric Dickerson and Walter Payton both had 4.4. Stating that, Fred Jackson had a 5.5 YPC avg last year. Still Freddy can't touch this kid with his 4.27 speed. I watched as the Bills used Tashard Choice over Spiller at times, which made no sense to me. Who knows if this coaching staff will ever get the potential out of Spiller. All I know is with that kind of speed I'd have had this kid on the field every offensive play the last two years, as either a RB or WR. I'd find ways to get him the ball * EDIT

Shut up troll... I can remember you from all last off season blasting Fitz over and over every chance you got and in every post you made. I'd call that a crusade against a good Bills player. I take your opinion for what its worth..NOTHING! Think I'll take Chan Gaileys opinion over yours when he stated he can win with Fitz! Dunno why a even bother to respond to your trolling...perhaps for other actual Bills fans who read your crap. Fitz played on some pretty terrible teams throughout his career up until last year. But that was only until week 8 or so. Then after the Injuries to the LT and Center, WR's and Fred Jackson the Bills became a bad team again. The Bills OC didn't help much in the fact that he kept calling for passing plays over and over with a decimated offense. Not to mention to how bad that defense was all last year #26 in total defense and no pass rush. Even Nix admitted the Bills defense made bad QB's look like HoFers. So the Bills were always playing catch up by passing, which put Fitz in constant bad situations. No QB can succeed like that!

NFN, but I've been saying for years the Bills have had NOBODY in that Bills OC position that knew WTH they were doing!! Even Jauon's first OC Steve Fairchild wasn't a true OC as Mike Martz called the offensive plays in St Louis. So yea! It doesn't shock me in the least to hear Fitz state he has never had proper training in proper fundamental QB technique. Kinda the reason as to why JP Losman and Trent Edwards were never developed properly either. I look at Fitz and see a Rich Gannon type clone, another QB who was also a very smart guy. A seasoned journeyman veteran QB that flourished under offensive minded Jon Gruden near the end of his 17 year NFL career, and took his team to the super bowl. Didn't become a pro bowl QB until his10th year, and played on some pretty crappy teams before he joined the Raiders. Fitz is a very smart guy, and not just book smart as 49 out of 50 on his "wonderlic"will tell you. He also learned how to beat the AFC north teams during his time in Cincy. That was evidenced by the way he played in 2010 against the Steelers, Ravens, Bengals, Browns. So it stands to reason if given time he will learn how to beat Rex Ryans, Bill Belichicks and Mike Nolans defenses, the main ingredient in the recipe to winning the AFC East. I think teams don't necessarily need to develop a "franchise" QB from scratch as long as they build the offense properly, starting with the O line. Build the very best O line you can, get the QB a top TE as an outlet. Get a top WR corps and go from there to see what the QB can do if given time in the pocket. Stating that,the Bills still have a ways to go to catch teams like the NY Giants offensively! Line, receiving corps, play calling, offensive game plan. So in my view Fitz will do better this year just having a better line and proper QB coaching.

The Bills have 4 SB losses, and no wins... as do the Vikings. Now think about the Detroit Lions, Cleveland Browns, Jacksonville Jaguars, Houston Texans have never even been to a super bowl. Browns, 3 AFC Championships Jags, 2 AFC Championships Lions, 1 NFC Championship Texans made 1st ever playoff appearance in 2011 The Detroit Lions are the only non expansion team to have never made it to the super bowl. This year, Bills vs 49ers in SB...Bills win 28-24

The problem with VS is he wants to be paid like he is a top 5 TE, and he isn't even close. I think the main reason the Vikings let him go was because he thought he was worth more then what they would pay him. The Bills don't even use Chandler as much as they could in my view, why bring in another TE to take away targets from a decent younger player.

Yea, tell that to the 9-7 GB packers who won the SB in 2010. The 2007 wildcard NY Giants, the 2005 wildcard Steelers. The 2012 NY Giants went 9-7 during the regular season and got hot at exactly the right time. Beating the 13-3 49ers in the NFC Champ game AT Candlestick park! The 15-1 GB Packers in the divisional playoffs AT Lambeau. The Giants also beat the 15-1 GB Packers during the regular season last year, so they beat them 2x, the only two losses the Packers had last season! The NY Giants have a great O line. Their problem was they lost their starting LT at the end of the season. So they moved their all pro guard to LT and went on to win the SB. The Bills talent level is no where near what the NY Giants possess, not in any area! However, the biggest area of discrepancy in talent between both teams is in the coaching staff, and in the defense. The Bills have upgraded that D line this off season, now it remains to be seen if the Bills coaching staff can step it up!

Manning was a winner in college, he is a winner in the NFL! Fitz, OTOH ...has played on some bad teams throughout his career. Fitz still doesn't have an O line or receiving corps comparable to what Manning has had. Lets just hope he can win with less.

Did you actually read my entire post before blurping out a response? Do you know how pears and urbik came to the team in 2010? Cornell Green was the guy Nix pegged in free agency to open 2010, and when he stunk up the line so badly they cut him after 5 games. It was then that Nix scoured the waiver wire to pick up those 2. I'm not saying those 2 couldn't get coached up and develop into better players, they might. What I'm saying is that they both haven't had to block for a lot of mid to deep passing plays in the Buffalo offense. Even when Fitz was able to get the ball out in 2 seconds and under he was still pressured quite a bit and still hit very often. Wood and levitre are the only real solid players on that line and Wood is coming off IR for the 2nd straight season. That right side is still very questionable and the world will see what I'm writing about when Fitz tries to throw deep.

That O line is no where near a team strength... Center Eric wood has spent the last two seasons ending up on the IR, I love the guy but the team has a dire need at depth at the center position. The Bills drafted some late round picks to fill in for depth at OT & Center, but what happened to the last batch of later round O line players the Bills drafted? The right side of that O line is still waiver wire castoffs from other teams. Since the Bills employed a fast paced short passing game last season that has Fitz getting rid of the ball in 2 seconds or under, it simply wasn't that difficult to hold a pass block last year. Still Fitz took a great deal of pressures and hits after he got rid of the ball. The second half of last season Fitz had some difficulty in keeping that offense rolling. The WR injuries & line injuries to the LT and center positions were the killers. Most teams had already figured out that the Bills didn't have a good mid- range passing game and their deep passing game was basically nonexistent. This made defending that bills offense so much easier then a normal NFL offense that can throw short, mid and deep passes. Now that teams know what to expect in Chan Gailey's offense the Bills need to open up the mid to deep passing game to change things up. Probably why they drafted speedster WR TJ Graham. In order to do that the QB will need a pocket to step up into and more time in the pocket to take the 5-7 step drops. when the Bills do that the OT's will need to hold their blocks longer then 2 seconds, possibly 3-5 seconds. .With a rookie at LT and 2nd year player behind him, and that right side being what it is.... I just don't see that Bills having much success at anything other then that short passing game again this year. So yea, Nix should have started rebuilding that O line 3 year ago, and just about now they would be seasoned enough to play very well.

It is so difficult to deal with someone so set in their thinking that nothing they read will even make them consider changing their mind..... What you get with bad teams is usually bad choices all around, bad choices in coaches, bad choices in the schemes those bad coaches run. Bad choices in the players they select. Even when bad coaches make the right choices on players, the players don't always play their best because they are hindered in bad systems, bad schemes. I don't even blame Aaron Maybin or John McCargo, I blame the moron who drafted them , I also blame the moron who hired the guy who drafted them