Alphadawg7

No he went like 2/5

I want to believe in Bass...but I would be lying if I said I am not concerned, especially with how he started the OTA's.

Without question Brady is the GOAT because hypotheticals don't exist. All that exists is reality and its history. Brady is the one with 7 rings, he is the GOAT, there is no debate. Can I say for sure that he was the most talented and gifted QB to ever play...No. Do I think other QB's could have accomplished 7 rings if they had played in his place with his longevity...Yes. Do I think another QB could have won more than 7 rings if they had played in his place with his longevity....Possibly. Brady though is the GOAT, what he did and accomplished both in Rings and Longevity makes it indisputable. But am I certain he is a better QB overall than some of the other guys with top 5 and top 10 resumes...no I am not. The guys who was previously considered the GOAT was Montana...can you or anyone say for sure he was a better QB than Montana? I can't for sure say that. Montana played in an era where QB's took a beating and his body eventually failed him early. But at the time Montana retired he had 4 rings and was 4-0 in Super Bowls where Brady also had 4 SB rings, but had also lost 2. If Montana got to play in the era Brady did where you couldn't touch the QB, rules were rigged to help the passing game and receivers, and got the same special treatment from the refs that Brady got then maybe he could have played longer and his body wouldn't have broken down. And if you put Brady back in the Montana era where he gets hit and the CB's can still be physical with receivers, does he still play past 40, does he still get 7 rings? Since we can never know those answers, Brady is legitimately the GOAT based on his accomplishments. But I can't say for sure that he was the actual best QB to ever step on a field.

Right before Brady went up to close the show on the Roast of Tom Brady, Peyton Manning came out and stated BB was the greatest coach in NFL history. You don't think Manning knows had he been in Brady's shoes he would have more rings too? Manning and the Colts went one and done an NFL record 9 times in Indy, and the biggest reason was defensive issue. When he finally had a defense, they won the SB. Put Manning in NE with the greatest defensive mind in NFL history and Manning gets several more rings. I think that is a pretty safe bet. I dont know that Brady wins more than 1 ring in Indy like Manning if he played there though.

The same as Kelly...no rings.

1. Are you sure it's only current QB's and not any QB all time with at least 350 attempts? 2. You have to have enough of a sizable sample for the sample to matter in terms of determining a reliable expectation. 3. I am not the one who found the stat, it was in the article I linked. The one in the poll was the original, but it caused some early talk to go the wrong direction, so clarified it better in the post title and forgot to adjust it in the poll.

I hear you, but…It has happened…it’s just the D folded and gave up the lead Allen gave them.

I get that, and no argument from me. But I will add in that Mahomes started off getting to sit behind Alex Smith while learning from Andy Reid and working with HOF offensive talent around him. Then you have Allen, who started off with Nathan Peterman as the top QB on the roster, got thrown into starting in the 2nd half of his first game, while playing for a team that was tearing the roster down before it could begin a rebuild process the next season with a first time HC who was a DC previously and has had 3 OC's in the past 4 seasons as well. So there is no way that some of that doesn't impact some of those things above. And as far as drive to win and elevating the guys around him, there is no denying that they are at least equal in both. Every WR that has come to Buffalo has had their best seasons of their career with Allen by definitive amounts. He has made bums like Robert Foster look like he belongs in the NFL even. And Allen is as competitive and driven to win as any player in the league, and few can match him in those categories (Mahomes being one for sure though).

Yeah, I will take a SB over a player 100% of the time. Ravens don't love their SB trophy any less because Dilfer was their QB. Allen and Mahomes are easily to the two most need to watch players in the NFL, on any given play they can do something that no one else can do. Its like watching Barry Sanders play, on any given play you can have your mind blown. I just came across these articles and its a good reminder to just how good Allen really is, and with less. I think his rings are coming, and yes, I said "rings" as in multiple.

Show you what? What are you even asking me to show you? So...Allen has more touchdowns working with less...but you think somehow if Mahomes and Allen switched spots Allens numbers wouldn't be even better? LOL..come on, that is rich from you. Arent you the same guy who has been complaining about the lack of weapons for Allen? The same guy who has complained about our coaching? So for you to say that now would contradict a lot of your past rants about the coaching and weapons around Allen.

Allen had 2 OC's over that span, a first time OC who was fired 10 games into his 2nd season. Mahomes had Reid. You don't think that carries some weight in that comparison? Mahomes also had a defense that didn't force him to carry the team and press. Allen had a disgruntled WR as his top target...Mahomes had his bestie in Kelce as his who is probably also the GOAT at TE. The 2 situations are not equal. What if Mahomes and Allen swapped spots these past 2 years? You don't read enough social media or watch enough sports talk shows as it happens allllll the time.

Yet the 2 time MVP is Lamar Jackson.

Didn't realize passing TD's were worth more points than rushing TD's.

You know Allen only played 9 more games than Mahomes as a rookie right? Yet he is a sizeable lead on the TD's for first 6 years still, and again has nearly a 20 TD lead over Mahomes in the last 4 years playing for a defensive HC and 3 different OC's. And Allen started with trash on a team being torn down for 2 seasons before the rebuild really started. Mahomes started on a playoff caliber team with a HOF HC and 2 all time greats to throw too.

This year...for me...its Von Miller. I know a popular choice is Elam, but I am still optimistic on Elam, not ready to condemn him, so I don't want to be wrong about that lol. But Miller is a player I have had real doubts about being able to really get back to being a real contributor. I know there are positive reports out there, but the game changes dramatically when pads are on and the games begin. And at his age, expecting a resurgence is asking a lot. What I fear most is this...he comes out early and starts to look like he is back and its more of a mirage and is on the field too much because of it. Maybe gets 4-6 sacks in the first 6 games for example because he comes out fired up and that has people thinking he really is back. But he is old now, and its been a long time since he played a full season and then had to play a post season too. I fear his legs will fade the more reps he gets and becomes a liability again in the playoffs. Too much is made of sacks...sure they are great, but if a player gets say 8 sacks on a season...that is just a measly 8 plays he made...what happened on all the other plays? Is Von going to be a liability most plays but still manage to make 8 to 10 plays over the course of a season? What condition will he be in come playoffs if he plays the whole season is a real concern because it is the post season where we have NOT had a Chris Jones like player making the key stops to seal wins for Allen like Mahomes has had. So if the game is on the line, will Von have enough Juice to make the play...worse yet, if he doesn't will he still be on the field than say someone like AJE who may have a better shot at making a real play? I think it is almost worse if Von has some early season success then fades because he may be getting too many reps come playoff time based on that and that could hurt us more if he gets too many postseason snaps and isn't up for it.

Allen has More TD's than Mahomes over their first 6 years...Allen has more TD's since 2020 than Mahomes by a wide margin. Mahomes started his first season with a TE and WR that are amongst the best to ever play, a HC that is credited as being one of the best offensive minds in NFL history, and after sitting a year behind a pretty good QB in Alex Smith. Meanwhile...Allen started his career learning from Nathan Peterman, playing for a first time HC who was a defensive mind, on a roster being torn down to shed cap to start rebuilding the year after from the ground up, throwing to Fat Albert Benjamin, burrito hands Zay Jones, and hands made of Clay at TE. So if you want to just compare thier first full seasons then you haven't been paying attention. And no one is denying that...but what if Allen was playing for KC in those same playoff games? How much better would his numbers be under Reid and having guys like Kelce and Hill and having a defense not choke away games with players like Chris Jones making the plays to end them? That is the real question...if all things were equal, would it really still be Mahomes or not? I think the answer to that question is a lot closer than people think.

Rings will always win every argument...I get that, and its fair. But ultimately, having watched the players around Allen squander Allens own greatness in the post season gets held against Allen way too much and I think it creates this huge gap between how people see Mahomes and Allen respectively. But I think they are a lot closer than Allen gets credit for personally, and if Allen gets say 2 rings he will have his own case for best in the NFL.

I agree, its going to be Mahomes...but that is because of the SB rings...and Mahomes has also had the people around him make the plays needed to win in the postseason, especially on defense, where Allen has not. Meanwhile Allen has had 3 OC's in last 4 seasons, and a defense that never made the big play in the postseason. Especially in 2021 and 2023, Bills should have beaten the Chiefs twice...but KC had guys make the plays, while Allens teammates didn't. Diggs dropping passes, defense giving up leads with 13 seconds and coming up lame in OT. Meanwhile, guys like Chris Jones is out there wrecking offenses to seal games for Mahomes. So I think the question is a lot close than people think.

For my opinion on my own question... Mahomes and Allen can do things no other QB in the NFL can do, they are clearly the top 2 guys. However, there are a couple more things Allen can do that Mahomes can't, and I think you see that reflected in the TD total gap and it comes down to what they can do with their legs. Both are excellent at using their legs to extend plays or make a huge play running with the ball. However, Allens power and size just afford him a slightly bigger arsenal than Mahomes. So for me...I think if you swap Allen into KC instead of Mahomes, Allen has the rings and Mahomes doesn't and Allen would be building a GOAT resume while people would be debating if Mahomes is QB2 or outside the top 5 in the media like they do with Allen. Bottom line...both these guys are special...and its a fun to watch them both play and picking who is better is always going to come down to rings, so hopefully Allen gets his so he can be on more equal footing in this question.

I think it's safe to say that if you polled the coaches, GM's, and players that Allen would be QB2 behind Mahomes by the end of that poll. And I think the vote would be pretty decisively Mahomes 1 and Allen 2. In the media, amongst fans, social media, etc he would probably still finish QB2 but likely by a narrower margin as he has a larger group of detractors there then the people who play against him. But what do the numbers say? Well I think they may surprise some... The QB's job is to score points, and right off the bat we know he has the most TD's in NFL history for a players first 6 seasons. Now the detractors will come back and say that is only because Mahomes sat his first year...well that isn't accurate, Mahomes played 1 game and Allen missed 6 games. So Allen only played 9 games more his rookie year and did so throwing to Benjamin as his lead WR without the luxury of sitting a year behind a quality vet. But...lets remove this argument all together and just focus on since 2020 when Allen arrived as a top tier QB. Since 2020, Allen has the most TD's in the NFL with 174. In 2nd place is Mahomes with a distant 151. 3rd place is even further back at 125 (Herbert). Allen has an NFL record 4 consecutive seasons of 40+ TD's and counting. He puts up 40 again and he extends that record to 5 consecutive seasons. And Allen has done that with 3 OC's in 4 seasons, and an inferior set of weapons compared to many other top QB's Some were saying 2023 was a down year for Allen, like he regressed and took a step back. But did he really? He led the NFL in TD's He led the NFL in TD's vs top 10 defenses with 20 He is first in points added per game vs top 10 defenses wtih 3.8 He again finished in top 5 voting for MVP and only person not named Lamar to get a vote and the only player to finish in the top 5 the past 2 seasons...and that was with Dorsey clown show for 75% of those games. And this was with tension with Diggs and an OC switch week 11. Then there is the argument that Allens turnovers are why he has not won a Super Bowl and why some lower is QB ranking below guys like Burrow who also has not won a SB, but had his defense help him reach one. Allen has the lowest Interception % of all QB's with at least 350 career playoff passing attempts at just 1.1%. Mahomes is 2nd at 1.2% He only has 2 lost fumbles in his playoff career too. There are a lot more stats you can review, I picked some of the more interesting ones from a couple different articles I came across, I will add the links below. So...who really is the best QB in the NFL if all things were equal? On one hand, Allen has statistically produced more with less advantages than Mahomes, but Mahomes has the rings ...but he also had the supporting cast make the plays when it matters, especially on defense because SB rings are a team accomplishment and too much credit/blame is assigned to the QB in regard to winning a SB or not. Josh Allen stats that will irritate non-Bills fans 20 Unbelievable stats for his 28th birthday

I’m not that confident haha. But I am down for a charity wager, but I’m not betting against Josh Allen ha

Ray Davis will get probably 8 of his TDs last year Under is an easy bet IMHO

I like the he Claypool signing too, but he has a lot of work to do still to overtake Samuel in terms of expected role. Unless Claypool flat out wins the job to start outside opposite of Keon, I think it will be hard to out touch Samuel if he is WR4 because he’s not keeping Shakir off the field.

I mean there are not many relevant signings in terms of expected roles, most were depth. I mean the only realistic answer is one of the WRs with Samuel currently being the only projected into sure consistent role. I can’t see any other signing, at least as we sit here today, expected to be a better player this year for this team than Samuel.

As we await camp to open, where is everyone at right now in terms of your biggest question lingering mark or concern? For me its CB depth. While I am very excited to see how Elam fairs once the pads go to see if he can push Benford to start, the reality is we don't have much of anything behind the trio of Rasul, Benford, and Elam with Elam still being an unproven commodity still. In a loaded AFC Conference full of fire power, it feels like we are dangerously thin at CB, especially since we still don't know what to expect from Elam at as either a starter or backup.