Alphadawg7

Diggs was not the issue, he did not fade. Allen's elbow injury was more of an issue that many think Dorsey's offense was not creative and didn't scheme guys open. Allen and Diggs got a lot of their production off improvising. Defenses figured out how to defend the Bills offense once GB put the blueprint out there. The OL was bad, and Allen saw his comfort behind the line disrupted We couldn't run the ball These are all the reasons we saw his numbers dip IMHO.

I wouldn't frown at signing him, he may be motivated too by Kelce now tying his TD record in the postseason. I wouldn't see this as an end all be all solution, but I think he can still offer enough to be a good player for this team on the right deal.

I agree...although I don't think it was Devins fault, I think he will be a better RB on a team that uses him effectively. But certainly not someone we should pay FA money to. I would rather sign Formean cheaper. But investing in the D has netted us 107 points given up and 1403 yards in last 3 playoff losses. So if you are gonna run this flawed Defensive system, we can have cheaper guys peform that bad...so shift the money to the offense this year.

I get where you are coming from, but even next year it will be hard to say Tre is one of the 4 best if he gets most his form back. Not only do you have the 3 you listed, you still have Gilmore, Ramsey, Woolen, Slay, Bradberry, Ward, Terrell, etc who all would have a case to be in your top 4 guys you listed here. Personally, I would put Slay in there right now or Gilmore with Woolen nipping at their heels. I think Tre could get back to being a top 10 guy at CB, but his days of being top 4 I think are gone betwen his injury and the influx of incredible new talent like Woolen and Sauce. For the record, I was PLEADING to draft Woolen all offseason last year, he was the guy I wanted most at DB based on where we were drafting. I liked Elam too, but Woolen was the guy I coveted because I assumed we were not getting one of the early guys (I mean Sauce was clearly the cream of the crop).

Hard pass on Cook being the top RB. He goes down when the wind blows. He is a Kamara style RB, not a heavy workload runner. I would sign D'Onta Foreman (or draft someone) to be the physical runner and let him and Cook split duties where Cook functions more as a Kamara style player.

He already recovered from that...not a story

Im with you on all this but Tre. Sadly, he isn't close to the top 4 guys right now, he wouldn't even be in the top 4 if he was in a category of just CB's who were rookies this year IMHO. And I love Tre, just being honest about where he is at today. Next year could be a whole other story though, not writing him off.

Agree on everything here, well said

I am sitting it an unusual position, and I don't like it. The 3 previous playoff exits in 2021, 2020, and 2019 I was left feeling very excited and optimistic about the next year, like we were just getting started or had arrived. 2019 - We had a 2 score lead at halftime, then a handful of self inflicted wounds, some REALLY BAD refs, cost us that game. But we were so young and felt like we starting to arrive and on our way to being one of the best teams in the AFC. 2020 - we go 13-3 and make the AFCCG but it felt like we weren't quite on the Chiefs level yet after that loss. But it did feel like we were nipping at their heels and just just a few tweaks away from over taking them as the top team in the AFC. 2021 - Allen, Davis, and the offense played out of their minds and gave so much hope for the next year. Like it took a fluke miscommunication by the ST Coordinator for the Chiefs to get a small window to steal the game back, but we had shown we were now the better team. It felt like we were the best team in football and could have beaten both the Bengals and then Rams in SB. But now this year, things feel different. Instead of feeling like we are on our way to being the best team, or that we are the best team in the AFC...it now feels like we are firmly behind KC and Cincy right now with other teams nipping at our heels even as the 3rd best team, including ones in our own division. And we are entering an offseason with key players on both sides of the ball as Free Agents, with a tight cap, and several holes to fill. Complicating it further, two of our most expensive players have ACL tears impact their potential value to the team (Tre and Von). That being said, it is not all doom and gloom, we are still a good team and are blessed to have Allen and Diggs still. But we do have a lot of challenges and decisions facing us as we head into the offseason: Before we even address the roster: Frazier and Dorsey likely back - Big mistake out the gate IMHO. Frazier has given up 107 points and 1403 yards the last 3 playoff losses, that is inexcusable, not to mention the 13 second debacle. Yes I know McD has a hand in the defensive system as well, but bringing in a new DC with new ideas and new ways to use players would still be a welcomed change. Dorsey was clueless on how to use our personnel this year. We only had 2 legit outside WR's and a roster full of slots, and yet he played an air it out deep ball game. We drafted an undersized RB in 2nd round to catch passes then barely threw him the ball and instead ran draw plays with him. We traded for Hines then gave him 10 touches. We had a weak spot at slot and yet didn't get Shakir more touches and experience. And of course we didn't run the ball. Our schemes and roster are not built for severe weather conditions, and that is going to be tough for us to remedy if we are going to stay the course with the same systems that Frazier and Dorsey brought this year. Personnel Concerns: We have a tight cap, and low round pick in each round. Poyer, Edmunds, and Devin are FA's - likely at least 2 gone, maybe all 3, creating new holes to fill while tight on cap space Von Miller - 34 and coming off ACL. We already saw with Tre, it's no easy task to come back from this injury, and he is trying to do it at 34. Big questions on when he will back as well as what kind of a player he can be, especially given he relies a lot on speed and quickness. Offensive Line needs significant help, and we don't yet know if Morse will be back either. Between age, concussion issues, and Hamlin scare, it would not surprise me to see him retire, and honestly, he probably should as he has had too many concussions over his career. Need at least 1 more quality WR Secondary concerns - What kind of players will Tre and Hyde be next year? Can Elam take over a starting spot? Will Benford convert to Safety and how well will that transition go if he does? Will Hamlin be back next year? I am not 100%, but I think Shaq is also a FA, and he was playing well for us...will he back if he is a FA? Right now, we are staring down the barrel of a tight cap situation while Cincy and our own divisional opponents continue to reap the benefits (as of now) of no big QB contract and will potentially have cap space to keep closing the gap while we will cap strapped and have existing holes and potentially new holes to fill with budget FA's and late in the round draft slots. My thoughts based on the above info: Bringing back both Dorsey and Frazier are only going to make next year harder IMO. But based on what we have heard since the loss, it seems pretty probable they will both be back. I think if we want any chance to contend next year come playoff time, we are going to need the offense and Josh Allen of 2021 to do it. Invest significantly in protecting Allen along the OL, at least ONE of our first 2 picks better be OL and I would invest 2 in the first 4 rounds. Would also see who we can add in FA. Get another legit WR opposite Diggs. Explore a trade, free agent or just take a WR early, first or 2nd round, to help Josh. Then commit to Shakir taking over the slot position. Cook is not physical, so go draft someone in mid rounds or sign someone like D'Onta Foreman at a bargain to be a more traditional runner (he can catch too) and let Cook play more of a Kamara role. Expand Knox's role as a pass catcher like they did down the stretch. Get back to using him in the redzone more. Try moving Benford to Safety, which was what they considered when they drafted him in the first place. Poyer and Edmunds - I am torn here. On one hand, Poyers value is undeniable...but you got age and injury history now playing into the discussion, plus cap space. Edmunds is easily coming off his best year and has been a major piece in our defense. But cap space is tight, and having BOTH of them has not kept us from giving up 107 points and 1403 yards in our last 3 playoff losses. So, I think I am now leaning towards either let both walk, or keep Poyer on a short term deal and let Edmunds walk and use that cap space to invest as much as we can into protecting Josh and upgrading this offense. Look to replace Edmunds with a value add Free Agent and maybe try and find a young guy in the 3rd or 4th rounds potentially. I would try and package Ed Oliver for a draft pick(s) or even a quality player at a position of need. His impact is so dependent on the guys around him, he isn't consistently disrupting games and was just taken completely out of the game by Cincy's backup OL. I can't see investing heavy into him the following season, so I would trade him for assets or a player that can help this team next year. Our DT can be anchored by Phillips, Settle and Jones next year and not be any worse than its been the last 3 playoff losses. This would be my offseason plan, although that is not entirely true...my offseason plan would be to move on from BOTH Frazier and Dorsey and give McD one last year to get us over the hump before he hits the hot seat too. But, given it doesn't feel like either is going anywhere, I would say minimize our overhead on defense since it didn't help us the last 4 playoff exits and invest heavy into the offense. Who we draft will be a direct reflection of who we sign in FA prior...for example, if we sign Foreman at RB that makes drafting a RB less of a priority.

I am normally optimistic, especially with Josh Allen and Diggs here. But I can't find myself to feel good about next year right now. Between both coordinators and their weak schemes and system seemingly coming back and our tight cap situation with quite a few roster needs, it feels like best case scenario is we are a similar team next year instead of a "better" team. Meanwhile, Cincy, Miami, Jets, and Pats are all benefiting from rookie QB contracts and have (atleast right now) the cap space to actually get better and further widen (Cincy) or close the gap (our division). Every good team with a paid QB goes through roster decisions and turnover like we are. But when you are building a roster for both defensive and offensive schemes that we already know are weak points, how can the team truly get better? And we play both KC and Cincy next year to go along with playing in what should be another hard fought 6 games within the division in AFCE. I fully expect Pats, Jets, and Miami to both challenge for the playoffs and the divisional title next year if they make the right offseason additions. We can still win our division next year, heck maybe even the #1 seed if we can beat KC again and find a way to beat Cincy. But that path just seems harder than it was the past 2 seasons when we look down it today. And come playoff time, it's hard to imagine our defense getting the job done under Frazier given in the last 3 playoff exits we have given up 107 points and 1403 yards. I mean that is insane to imagine someone keeping their job after 3 horrific performances by the D in consecutive seasons.

It 100% is, always has been in the last 3 playoff losses where our "top 5 defense" has given up 107 points and 1403 yards in those 3 consecutive losses in the playoffs. How the hell Frazier is keeping his job right now is utterly MIND BLOWING. It is absolutely clear that its a failed scheme against top ranked offenses in the playoffs. If we run the same D next year, nothing is going to change. And same goes for Dorsey...he is as much a problem as Frazier. FIRE THEM NOW.

Exactly! His last 3 playoff losses: 107 points given up and 1403 yards. He should be fired. 107 points and 1403 yards given up in our last 3 playoff losses. Disputing Miami game is outside the point. But, the defense folded when it was needed in second half and we barely escaped with a win. Miami game was not a good look for either side of the ball.

All good, let me explain where i was coming from. The defense didn’t hold when we needed it to was the point, and we almost lost that game. Yes I realize our offense hurt them, but the narrative of the game was we barely won by 3 against a low round rookie. It wasn’t a good look for either side of the ball. And the yardage is deceiving, we gabe them a lot of short fields and they also had several wide open drops by guys like Waddle and Hill. The defense was being complained about all over the shoutbox and threads. Looking at the box score stats doesn’t have context of where the D was not holding up when it was needed. More importantly though, why are people responding so much about the Miami game? In the last 3 playoff loss games Fraziers defense has given up: 107 points and 1403 yards in 3 playoff lost games in 3 years. That is insanely bad, like inconceivably bad. He needs to be fired.

I didn’t say that. I said it often takes players a season to get back into form. But every player and every injury are different. Really depends when Von is ready. But personally my expectations are low that he will be the same player as he was this year.

Still wasn’t a good look from our whole football team and then we laid an egg the next week. And it was the 4th straight loss in playoffs where defense played poorly

No offense, but this post is way off base. Many of us repeatedly told this board that it can take until the following season before a player comes fully back from this injury. Yet this delusion persisted that not only was Tre gonna be ready week 1, but he’d quickly get back to his old self. That was never likely going to happen no matter how many people tried to convince themselves otherwise. Bills don’t have a Tre problem (at least not yet), they have a problem with inaccurate expectations on Tre from fans this past season. Tre may or may not get back to the player he was, but that was never really going to be known until next season.

I mean did you watch the Bengals and Dolphin games? It’s a what have you done for me lately league, and his defense struggled against a depleted Dolphins team and then utterly embarrassed by the Bengals. Too much focus always on recency bias in this league. You can be great one day and a problem the next. 2 weeks ago McD was beloved, untouchable, had some COY support growing, and now has his head being called for. Josh Allen was a top 2 QB by most standards 2 weeks ago…now he’s suddenly the new Phillip Rivers and people turning on him. A lot can change in 2 weeks in the NFL

I kept saying we did not need to take an undersized DT in Oliver that year. Like 98% of this board would freak out and was demanding we take Oliver. Almost everyone here wanted Oliver.

Believing he’s the same guy that put up 1700 yards was your first mistake. He just isn’t ever going to be that guy again.

Exaclty. This Sean Peyton nonsense can’t stop soon enough. We are NOT giving up a first round pick for a HC, never gonna happen. And Peyton struggled to even make playoffs a lot of years with Drew Brees slinging for tons of yards. He is overrated and giving up a first round pick to the saints to sign him is insane

This team stopped having fun playing football. Too much heavy stuff lingering over them.

I honestly don’t know how to simplify this further for you. Not being rude, but I have clearly stated something and you keep turning it into something else. I did NOT say the Bengals gained an advantage, as in bad weather boosts them. I have like 5 times now very specifically stated the Bills are at a disadvantage in bad weather because they are not built well for bad weather conditions. Our offense is an air it out offense that can’t run the ball. Our defense plays off the ball zone and in bad weather it makes it even harder to get up in receivers allowing them to be wide open and exploited all day. Our DL depends on our secondary to buy them time to get home on the QB, and they can’t in bad weather when the secondary is giving up so much space to targets. Bottom line: We are not built for bad weather and teams like Cincy and KC are plenty capable of playing in bad weather. We see a bigger drop in our optimal play in bad weather than they have.

What? Lol come on, go rewatch the game. Yeah, I don’t know how that isn’t more clear to some. The drop off in play on both sides of the ball is more significant for us than our opponents in bad weather. The way this team is built, it’s hurting us more than it’s helping us.

My point is pretty clear. This team is at a DISADVANTAGE on both sides of the ball in bad weather. I didn’t say at home, I said in bad weather. We are built soft like a dome team. We do not have any kind of “advantage” in bad weather, regardless where the game is played when facing these other top teams.

Not against the ones we see in playoffs