Alphadawg7

It wasn’t that easy for our offense to play in either. One of our players on Twitter using weather as excuses for dropping passes even. With us not being great at running the ball in these bad weather games, it makes me remain skeptical just how much of an “advantage” it really is for this offense to be at home in bad weather. Don’t get me wrong, the fans are amazing and stadium is amazing environment. But as much as we say it’s an advantage, end of the day bad weather is not a friend to what this offense does best either.

I think if you watch the play again you will see he was not wide open because Josh made a bad pass and shorted it and there was a defender there as a result.

I'm a lot more comfortable punting than I am turning the ball over. We have more turnovers from Josh against the Jets than we do blocked punts. The blocked punt earlier was helped by being backed up against the endzone too, not punting from the open field. I think if you did the math on the odds of a punt being blocked vs the odds a QB turns the ball over via fumble or INT it will prove punting is a far less risk. My point with McD is he is not going to throw anyone under the bus. And since there was no disaster outcome, there was not a lot to talk about anyway about the incomplete pass. It would be a much hotter and talked about subject if it had resulted in a turnover or allowed the Jets to at least score a TD and be in position to tie the game with a 2 point conversion.

Just curious...if that ball was intercepted, what would you be saying today?

Because with a sack you create the possibility of a strip sack by our QB who has been prone to fumbling. You also take away the likelihood of getting a first down running the ball when you are facing 2nd down and more than 10 yards. To be clear, I did not advocate for him to be fired, and this play call will not get any attention moving forward. What I was implying when I said he put his job in jeopardy when he called that play was referring to if we would have gone on to lose the game because of that play. Not saying his job is in jeopardy today because of it. Meant the play call opened him up for some potential real bad outcomes if it had not ended well. And lets be real here, if that timeout ended up helping the Jets tie and win the game in OT, this board would be melting down today with wanting to fire McD and Dorsey over that call...and probably Frazier too. End of the day...the risk in bad weather against a defense that we struggled to pass against for 2 consecutive games was a lot riskier than just running the ball 3 times and giving the ball back in the event we don't get the first down with no timeouts and 40ish second left on the clock for the Jets to try and score on our defense that was playing lights out against them.

Our option is already on the team, his name is Dawson Knox. What I would do instead is go find a dedicated blocking TE than can do it close to as good as Knox so we can then turn Knox loose in the passing game instead of primarily using him to block.

And if Josh fumbles in the rain or throws an INT...2 things he has struggled with this year...then what? Jets have a short field, over a minute to go, and 3 timeouts. I am not against kill shots...but there is context to every one of them, and they are not all equal. Our Defense was playing stout. Their defense was also playing stout, and the strength of their D is pass defense, especially with Q. Williams out of the game. You take a risk on a kill shot there when you fear you won't be able to keep the other team from driving the whole field with 40 seconds and no timeouts. There was no reason to fear that from the Jets. There was 100% reason to fear we could turn the ball over or not complete the pass given we struggled in bad weather all game to pass the ball again on this strong pass defense. This kill shot, under these circumstances was a mistake. And that is coming from me who is about as aggressive as it gets when it comes to taking chances in football. This was a moment in the game where the risk out weighed the reward given the likely hood of the Jets ability to drive the field with no timeouts in 40 seconds was much lower than the risk of turning the ball over or giving the Jets a little more help to drive the field by giving them a free timeout.

He said the same thing about the 13 seconds. Then not long after the game our ST Coordinator "stepped down" to take a lateral move to be the ST Coordinator for the lowly Jags. So yeah, he isn't going to come out and throw someone under the bus, he has never ever done that once. And doesn't matter if McD supported the call, its still a mistake. Dorsey would defend that call too, does not make it the correct call. I promise you, every coach would defend every call you have ever disagreed with in your history of watching sports.

Sorry, but 48 seconds and a timeout is something that could have screwed us, but our defense stepped up. That is enough time to tie a game. It would have been a lot better to give them the ball back with no timeouts and have to go the length of the field. It would have been better to run the ball on first and pick up yards so its not 2nd and 10 and now being forced to run the ball 2 straight downs to make them use 2 of their 3 timeouts. By all accounts, the pass on first down literally opens up the possibility to lose the game, even if it works. You can still get sacked, you can throw a pick, you can have an incompletion...all of which are terrible outcomes compared to the ONLY positive outcome of a completed pass for over 10 yards and a first down. A short pass does nothing a run couldn't do, it only helps if it goes for over 10 yards. Any other result makes the play call a mistake. So no disrespect, but I wholeheartedly disagree that this was a good choice. If Allen fumbles or throws a pick, 2 things he has struggled with this year, then now they have 3 timeouts over a minute to go and a short field. The reward was not worth the risk, especially against a stong defense and with how well our defense was playing. When your defense is playing that well, you do not need to risk the game for a kill shot. You make them use the 3 timeouts, hope you run for a first down anyway and it's a mute point, and if not then punt the ball to the opposite side of the field and make them drive on your defense with no timeouts and 40ish seconds left in the game.

This is why many of us advocated for needing to address CB in the draft because even once a player returns from an ACL, it often can take until the next season before they really get all the way back. There is a mental aspect that is as important as the physical rehab portion to where a player can trust and play instinctively again versus having thoughts in the back of their mind not to hurt it again. Tre may find his form again this season, but there is no guarantee of that. I am confident long term he will be fine, but it's hard to predict when he can really find that sweet spot again where he plays freely without regard for his previous injury.

Dorsey put his job in jeopardy when we had the game in hand with an 8 point lead and a first down with just over a minute left in the game...but decided to PASS the ball on first down despite the fact the Jets had ALL THREE TIMEOUTS. WTF is this utterly stupid move. And it totally screwed us, but thankfully our defense bailed us out again. We actually punted with enough time and ONE TIMEOUT still for the Jets to give them a LEGIT shot to send that game to OT. It was one of the worst calls all season. Roll Josh out...fine...FAKE the pass and see if he can get some chunk yards and STAY IN BOUNDS. DO NOT under any circumstance stop the clock for the Jets without FIRST getting a FIRST down. This is football 101. IF...and ONLY if...its third down and you want to try and end the game right there, sure take a gamble on a pass, BUT NEVER on first down. We could have run for a first down and never even risked it. UNBELIEVABLE. That alone...that play call...could have cost us this game. Dorsey in my eyes has been a liability this year with his lack of creativity and adjustments, and lack of consistency in layering in the run game even when we are having success with it.

I am with you on all of that...just think that he should be more focused on stepping up next game instead trying to make a point to fans to validate multiple times in a game he didn't make a play that was there for him to make.

He isn't wrong, and honestly I think that has a lot more to do with Dorsey than it does our personnel. Once we had some tape, this offense was quickly figured out in terms of who to disrupt it. Dorsey has yet to adjust and we have been able to keep winning because of the sheer pure talent of Allen to will this offense to points no matter what. What is crazy to me is that we really could change 3 plays on the season and probably be undefeated right now. Better snap to end the first half by the backup center so Bass gets to kick his FG likely wins that game for us. Don't fumble the snap against Minnesota wins that game for us. And the Jets game...you could say if Davis doesn't drop the last pass or if Bass didn't miss his 50 yarder we probably win that game. Which I think is what makes this more frustrating because we have the QB and talent here to be better, but Dorsey isn't putting it all together for this offense yet.

I'm not saying grown adults should be talking crap to him personally, I agree with you on that, it's just a game, get over yourselves as fans. However, he is a professional athlete, it unfortunately comes with the territory and to come out and grand stand and say you come do my job if you think it's so easy is pretty weak and childish. All he has done here is transition this from immature fans being dumb, to now a personal spat between him and the fans. This approach didn't work out well with Beasley when he went on Twitter and chose to challenge those questioning him. Just think this was a big mistake and comes across as excuses, especially when no one else is making excuses nor does this excuse the other times he has made mistakes on the field this year that cost us drives, points, or a turnover.

I don't follow. He is the starter, how is he "not supposed to be the starter" when he signed a 2 year deal this offseason, had an open competition with Crowder and Shakir and then was named the starter. I have always really liked McKenzie, especially him as an individual. But I have stated over and over again (and soooo many people argued with me about this) that he is simply NOT a starting level player in the NFL, he is a gadget player, or a role player at best. He is not a cerebral player on the field, he doesn't have a polished route tree, he can not catch consistently in traffic, he doesn't have the strength to fight for tough yards, and he struggles to reign in tougher catches. He runs fast. That's where it starts and stops with him in terms of what he excels at, and that is ok, there is a role for that on this team. But...he is without question not a starting caliber player, but he is unfortunately our best starting option right now. I keep hoping to see Shakir break out and find a bigger role and more success each week to emerge as more of the go to slot guy with McKenzie being more of a role player. Unfortunately, that has not happened yet, but I hope for it every week because Josh needs a 3rd option he can trust. Reality is, Knox should be that 3rd option and is easily our best 3rd receiving option in the pass game...but he has been too valuable and important as a blocker this year its prevented him from being more consistently involved in the air attack. Its very similar to what is going on in SF with Kittle where Kittle has too much value blocking that they don't take advantage of his elite receiving ability enough there.

Lets see...how about the Jets receivers who didn't drop passes? How about the other passes he has dropped on the season? I get he struggles with catching wet balls, probably because I assume he has smaller hands given his smaller stature and the fact he doesn't have great hands to begin with. And most importantly...fans are not professional athletes paid millions of dollars to be better at catching harder to catch passes. This is such a whiney move by him, I am stunned he posted this. Could you imagine if every skilled professional did this? I can see it now...cell service is spotty and people complain just to see a Verizon Tech challenge the customers on Twitter to meet him at a bar and let them try and build their own network and see how stable it is lol.

Fair point on level of competition, and I do agree that I would like to see Elam getting back on the field. He looked good earlier this year, so wonder what it is that is just keeping him from seeing some snaps. My main point is that the defense has been a strength when healthy, yet the offense has been mostly healthy and wildly inconsistent. I’ve got serious concerns about Dorsey still who I don’t think has been good at adjustments thus far or using the personnel better.

I mean this “short sighted weakness” to not play Elam over Dane has resulted in defensive dominance these past 2 weeks giving up 10 points each week only. I think maybe he sorta knows what he’s doing with those kind of results. I honestly don’t understand why so much talk about defensive concerns when the defense is thriving and the offense is what has been struggling more with consistency.

Lol,Not really...I said we are already a better defense now than last year even without Von. Only "If" I said is if we stay healthy...which is the exact same if for all 32 teams.

I think our DL is significantly better, even without Von, over last year where we were undersized and would frequently lose in the trenches. I think Groot is playing at a higher level too outside, and our role players like Shaq have been playing strong and also help against the run. Im bummed about Von, but if we can stay healthy outside of Hyde and Von, I think we are still a better defense than last year. If by some miracle we get Hyde back, even better.

Him and Jordan Phillips just seem to be at their best when they are here. I am glad to see that Shaq is getting some recognition around here because he has been a strong member of this defense this year.

I wonder how many of the current board members get this reference. I miss those days and that poster who shall remain nameless haha

He should, looking at what he has been able to do with our defense with all the injuries and the tough schedule makes him a top flight candidate IMHO.

I totally agree that 10 yards is too much, and even hit agree to your OP...however...given how often holding does happen in the league, a more severe penalty is unfortunately necessary to avoid it being tried even more than it already is. It is an unfortunately a necessary evil that can't go away.

Hahahaha nice one