Alphadawg7

2022 higher INT % than 2021. 2023 even higher INT % than 2022. Dorsey was the OC in 2022 and 2023 and it got worse both years. In 2 games immediately following Dorseys dismissal Offense is avg 13 PPG more than Dorseys final 6. During those 6 games, Dorsey led offense faced the weakest stretch of oppoosition on our schedule. Brady led offense after being thrown in mid season is avg 33 PPG and faced much tougher defenses in Jets and Philly. The Offense has not scored less than 32, 7 points more than the highest output in Dorsey's final 6 games. VS Jets, Dorsey led offense was 1-2 and averaged 17.7 PPG...Under Brady, we scored 32 even though we took our foot off the gas for the entire 4th quarter in a blowout. If you don't count the hail mary INT, Josh has 1 INT in 82 actual pass attempts which is a 1.2 INT% substantially lower than under Dorsey. Even if you count the hail mary, he is still significantly lower these 2 games than he was with Dorsey this season. There is no dismissing Dorsey from being a bit part of the problem. Doesn't mean there were not other mistakes or issues...but all teams have those by all players. But when the OC, or any coach, is fundamentally an issue then you will have inconsistency and players won't be in position to play their best. And that was the biggest issue with Dorsey, he was in over his head as a first time OC. Very well might learn what he needs to and grow and become a great OC one day, but he was hurting Allen and this offense and there is really no way refute that.

It climbed further this year under Dorsey too. So his two highest periods of his career were under Dorsey and getting worse. And again, Dorsey gone and Bills are avg 13 points per game more and against tougher competition. So everything still suggests Dorsey was a major issue for this offense and didn’t have Allen playing his best football either.

Then he got hurt and his first full season he had Higgins, Chase and Boyd. Allen spent 2 years throwing to scrubs on a team cutting players and eating dead cap space while Bengals were adding talent from the moment Burrow got there.

He is at 1.22% since Brady took over if you don't count the Hail Mary. 2 games is a small sample size, but its a substantial difference. Offense was avg 20.5 PPG final 6 games Dorsey was here against mostly pretty weak competition and 33 PPG against the stellar Jets D that smashed the Bills offense week 1 under Dorsey and a tough D from one of the best teams in the league on the road in Philly. In fact, Josh Allens INT % was 17% higher under Dorsey than Daboll, and that includes Daboll having to coach Allen his first 2 years as a RAW player with no weapons or talent around him to work with. Dorsey had prime Allen with Diggs and company, including this year which is probably the most talented offensive roster in the Beane/Allen ERA. So I think there it is safe to say that Dorsey is a big reason for that and it might just be different moving forward with Brady (or whoever if Brady isn't back next year).

Lost in this is that Josh Allen started his career off as RAW college prospect, forced to start game 1, with no talent around for 2 years on a franchise that was gutting its roster and cap space for a rebuild. His TD to Turnover ratio was 1.74 for 2018-2019 which drags his career number down and doesn't reflect the player he became. From 2020 on he above Burrow who started his career off with Tee Higgins and Chase after coming from a big college program, with better coaching, and more ready to play.

If that is the comparison you want to see, then go do the work and post a thread on it. You don't need to hijack another thread and try and get someone else to do the work for you that took the time to talk about something else.

LMAO you are kidding right? You can google "Josh Allen Interceptions" and find a long list too. And who does that? Turn on any of the mainstream sports shows and podcasts and they are always talking about interceptions. This is why its pointless to start threads on this board...honestly, prob be my last for a while.

And it is why coming into Philly that Dan Orlovsky pointed out that Josh was tied for 7th best with CJ Stroud on thowing the least amount of interceptable passes. He said that him leading the NFL still despite that in INT is a telling sign that his teammates are letting him down more than they should.

I addressed interceptions and frequency of them specifically for 3 reasons: 1. Almost every single person is referencing his interceptions in media. 2. Darius Slays comments after the Phi game saying that of course his INT totals will be higher with how much he has to throw. 3. The constant lazy Farve comparisons. This is literally why I looked into this and was curious to how Allen stacked up against not just Farve but other greats both recent and in the past. I did not start a thread about turnovers, fumbles or anything else...just fact checking where Allens interception rate was after Slays comments made me want to look into it. But others apparently have a different agenda...so be it.

LMAO, this is just getting comical now. I just can't explain this again...seriously my bad everyone for starting a thread about "interceptions" and expecting the conversation to be about "interceptions".

LMAO - so much for blocking me

What part of fumbles play into interception rate on passes attempted vs interceptions thrown? Still waiting for someone to answer that which is the topic of this thread despite the best efforts of some to change the topic to something else. This was about Allens int % compared to other greats to see how often it really is.

Still has nothing to do with the conversation around Josh's interception rate or this thread.

No, you only mentioned 56 fumbles and said those are not lost, but then didn't list the lost number of fumbles. If you know its 23 lost fumbles, then write 23 lost fumbles. Saying 56 and leaving a note that those arent all lost leaves it open to interpretation to seem worse than it is. 23 is a lot less than 56.

Josh Allen has 23 lost fumbles not 56. A fumble is not a turnover, a lost fumble is turnover. None the less, this isnt a thread about fumbles no matter how much you want to make it be.

Bahahaha, didn't notice that haha my bad. Well I also started a thread in 2021 and said we would win out on our final 6 and I again think we will win our final 5 now, so fun revisit either way

Hahaha that would be interesting

The thread title and OP analysis was almost entirely the rate of frequency that Josh throws an INT, which has nothing to do with TD's. The topic of conversation very specifically is around his interceptions. I added a small piece of bonus content at the end to just see how often he scored vs throwing an interception and spot checked it against a couple greats...why, because we are talking about interceptions. I guess shame on me for staying on topic about interceptions in a thread about interceptions.

To be fair...people have been saying BB and McD (Beane too) were going to get fired for a while and yet all of them got recent extensions. I just find that what people say doesn't always align with what happens. For BB to come here both him and McD need to get fired, and while possible, still seems unlikely to me right now that both get fired this offseason.

No, read the thread title and OP. This thread is discussing the narrative around his interceptions which if you turn on a TV is what is predominantly being discussed. Again, if you or the other poster you quoted want to start your own thread to talk about a completely different topic, then feel free to do so and I will be happy to participate in it. But the thread title and OP very specifically identified the topic of this conversation. No, his interceptions and leading the NFL right now in interceptions is predominantly what is being discussed. Regardless, this thread is discussing the narrative around him being prone to interceptions and if that is accurate or not.

Love the optimism, but Bills can't win the division if they win out and are not even assured of making the playoffs if we win out. We need Miami to lose 2 of their next 5 if I am not mistaken for shot at division and we need some other teams to lose as we are currently 10th in the AFC, so we both need to win out and need some help. But I do think we will win out, and that should get us in the playoffs and I think we at least make the AFCCG if we make the playoffs. So I am with you on the optimism in general

BB signed an extension, so why do people keep bringing him up like he is even an option in the first place?

I was referring to seasons...I said worst period - as in what was Josh INT % during the period with Daboll vs the his INT % with Dorsey. And you are only furthering my point as the first 2 years Daboll had hm, Josh was raw and had very little talent or weapons around Josh. Yet Josh INT % was still significantly lower during the time with Daboll than with Dorsey. And yes, sample size is small with Brady, but you can't dismiss that mid season the offense went from 20.5 PPG against weak defenses the previous 6 games to 33 PPG against tough defenses in Brady's first 2 games with the same personnel and not having the luxury of spending a whole offseason putting his stamp on the offense (Dorsey had 2). Josh Allen since Brady took over has 710 yards and 7 TD's in 2 games against tough defenses, and one of those games was in a terrible rain storm. NIGHT & DAY difference from Dorsey, so its relevant. Again, we are discussing frequency of interceptions, has nothing to do with fumbles. Feel free to start a thread to discuss what ever you would like...but here, we are specifically talking about his interceptions and if he is really as prone to throwing Interceptions as he has made out to be. Which has nothing to do with fumbles.

Coming into the Philly game, I saw Dan Orlovsky say that Josh was tied with CJ Stroud as the 7th best in the NFL on throwing the least amount of interceptable passes, yet he still leads the NFL in INT's. So why is that...well it suggests two things...good throws by Josh that turn into INT's from a mistake by the receiver and more volume on attempts than lots of other QB's.

Under Dorsey, Allens INT % was 17% higher than under Daboll or even Brady. Technically if you don't count the hail mary INT, Allen has 1 INT on real throws in 2 games under Brady and his INT % is half what it was under Dorsey, although the sample size is way too small. But even if you count the hail mary his INT % is the same as Daboll which is much better than Dorsey. And no disrespect, but fumbles are not part of the equation when discussing his rate of throwing interceptions, which is what I was addressing here, the media's narrative around how many interceptions Josh throws.