Alphadawg7

All fair points prior to today. But week in and week out of winning on that football field this season, Daquan is of higher importance of being on the field than Von given the players we have at Edge already and the importance of Jones in the middle.

No disresptect...but let me update your list. 1. Matt Milano 2. Daquan Jones . . 3. Tre White 4. Von Miller I love Tre White and Von Miller...but their importance to this team are not on the same level as Milano and Jones right now. Jones has been the best DT in football the first 4 weeks and was hurt doing what he does blowing up 3rd down to force 3 and out on the first drive. This team can live without Tre and proven that as Bills have had statisticaly the best secondary in the NFL over the past 3 seasons coming in despite Tre missing basically a season and a half of that between the injury and then not being near himself when he first returned. Von, while he was great last year before being hurt, isn't nearly as essential this year with Floyd here, Groot growing more, and AJE emerging. So while I am excited to see if he can get back, even if he does, the pass rush isn't going to get the same boost given how well the others are playing compared to how much Milano boosts the defense when he is on the field and Jones boosts the interior play at DT when he is.

Im not gonna dispute the fact this team tends to start slow...I say it all the time, the defense tends to give up an early easy TD before it clamps down. Never understood why, on one hand its good to see in game adjustments work so often, but what is going wrong in the pregame script that keeps the players and D from coming out that way is a legit question. But this defense has been amongst the the best in the NFL this year and much better under McD than Frazier To slam the D like the OP is...well...its just absurd. No team is perfect, plenty of things anyone can nit pick at with any team most weeks. But the defense has been great. We lost against the Jets because of Dorsey and Allens poor decisions pressing too hard. We lost against the Jags because Dorsey is a moron and went away from everything we excel at...again. That is the point here...to point fingers at the defense who still kept the Jags at 11 points late into the 4th missing 5 of its best players is incredibly misguided.

Wait...wait..wait...did you just double down on this already horrible take by slamming the D in the previous 4 weeks too? The same D giving up the 2nd fewest points in the NFL with the most sacks, turnovers, and interceptions in the league??? The only D to shut down Miami too? The same D that held Hill to 3 catches for like 53 yards? The fist D to sack Tua all year? Wow...just when I thought this take couldn't go and get worse you one up it. Kudos, didn't see that coming

Let me see if I understand you...the defense losing its best players is an excuse...the same defense who entered the London game BEFORE losing most those players was: 2nd fewest points allowed Largest margin of victory in NFL First in sacks First in Interception First in takeaways And that is despite the fact we faced the top offense in the NFL in Miami, still the only team to shut them down and first to sack Tua. But its an excuse when that same defense enters the game missing its starting corners in Tre and Benford and its best DE in Groot...then loses its best overall player in Milano and what had been the best DT in the NFL so far this year in Jones. That is an excuse? Guys who missed the game, exited the game, or had to miss plays in the game with injuries or other issues: Tre, Benford, Groot, Milano, Jones, Von, Taron, and AJE. I mean, that wouldn't be a terrible start to a pro bowl roster, and that is an excuse? And YET we still had only gave up 11 points until late into the 4th quarter. Come on...this thread is unreal. The defense was utterly gutted and devastated Sunday. Jones played 4 snaps for crying out loud, one of which where he got hurt was a massive tackle for loss to force a 3 and out. Excuses...you mean facts.

Yeah...ummmm...I think your expectations are a tad high on this one. Glad he is here for depth, but hoping he will go out there and shine suddenly after over a decade in the league feels like a reach

This. I mean I don't really understand how this thread can even exist today TBH

Fair points all around there. Still doesn't change my concern about what it will be like to play Miami in Miami down Tre, Milano, and possibly Jones for the whole game. Like you said, you would expect Allen to put up 50 there...Tua and that offense have the same capability to capitalize on those players missing. Not to mention the other tough offenses in the AFC and NFC we will face down the stretch, playoffs, or Super Bowl if we reached it. Don't get me wrong, I am still optimistic the defense can still be good enough, but at the same time, Dorsey and this offense need to be on point moving forward, and my confidence in Dorsey is not very high right now.

I can't find anything as of yet, but all the talk has been as if we are losing him for the season. Just wondering if it's been confirmed yet or not that he did tear his pec. I know I have been operating off the assumption he is lost for the season, but that is just soley based on everyone else's talk like he is, yet I still can't find anything that says he is actually out for the season and the pec is torn. Hoping it is still possible its a strain or something versus it being a torn pec...so am I missing something, or is it still possible he isn't lost for the season?

You are not wrong, and I am optimistic about even Dorian who I felt looked pretty solid considering the situation. But end of the day, it was the Jags who don't have a good OL, who haven't been a good offense, and Trevor hasn't been very good all year. We still got gashed by Etienne and lost the game. We still couldn't stop the air attack at times and got saved multiple times by penalties by the Jags negating good plays and taking negative yards and putting them behind the sticks where our defense could make more of an impact. I am much more concerned about the loss of Jones when we face teams like Eagles, Chiefs, Miami, and even the Bengals (whose offense looked substantially better this week). I mean think about the Dolphins game alone. If we had played last week without Milano and Jones, I think that is potentially a much different game. Maybe we still win because Allen and the O were perfect, but it sure wouldn't have been a blow out. I mean Jones and Milano were huge reasons why the defense turned it around after giving up those first 2 TD's with little resistance. Next time we face Miami we wont have the best player at all 3 levels of our defense in Tre, Milano, and Jones. And those are the ones just guaranteed to not play, who knows if anyone else will be dealing with any injuries that week, those are just the guys we today know for sure won't play. That means we are going to need Allen and the O to be near perfect again. And we can't win this division without sweeping Miami IMO unless Miami goes on another skid like last year as they are already up a game on us as it is, but its hard to see where they do it looking at their remaining schedule. And going into Miami down Tre, Milano, and Jones makes that game a lot different than this last time we played them.

Agreed, your point remains, the offense is still good. But to be fair, Josh has taken plenty of criticism, even more than he often deserves at times. And in regards to the OC...Great QB's have made a lot of "OC's" look better than they were, its not new and rather common.

I saw someone in another thread talk about how he felt he looked good out there...and I was confused because I couldn't recall seeing him do much of anything out there. There was one play where Von ran such a rounded wide rush at the QB he was at least 10 to 15 yards away by the time the QB threw the ball. It was so wide it looked like he was almost running to the flat to cover a backwards pass screen, except there was no RB or WR in the vicinity. Im glad he is back, but I don't think he should be anything right now other than the 4th guy in the rotation. Groot, Floyd, and AJE have been very good, and I especially don't want to take AJE off the field right now in favor of a 34 DE trying to get his legs back after a torn ACL. AJE is in a contract year, and making an impact with the opportunities he is finally getting after basically being buried here since getting drafted. I would rather see what he can keep doing so we know if we should try and keep him as part of the future here or not this offseason. Let Von slowly get into shape to be at his best come playoff time. This past offseason I kept saying AJE is better than people think and could start or compete to start on many other teams, but the kid has just been buried since arriving in Buffalo and not gotten a real opportunity to play significant minutes. And so far, he is making the most out of those opportunities and I would like to see if he can keep it up as the season progresses before we need to make a decision on trying to retain him or let him walk. And because of the high level play of Groot, Floyd, and AJE...the return of Von feels less impactful, even if successful, compared to the loss of Tre, Milano, and possibly Jones for the season.

Agree, our DL has been very good and amongst the best in the NFL this year. This is where I disagree. Jones loss is big, maybe almost as big as Milano. The impact of losing Jones will be felt on all 3 levels of the defense. Those guys wreaking havoc as you mentioned above is true, but Jones impact has been a big reason why. His ability to wreck the middle and bring pressure there makes the jobs of Ed and the edge guys so much easier to get home. It disrupts the center of the pocket and timing of the QB to buy time for the others to get there if Jones doesn't get there himself. Not only does this help the upfront guys coming after the QB, but it often forces the QB into rushed or ill advised throws creating opportunities for the back end of the defense to make plays, PBU's, and interceptions. We were leading the league in Interceptions, Turnovers, and Sacks heading into the London game, and Jones impact was a big reason why. He was arguably the best DT in the NFL this season in terms of his level of play thus far. Im not saying we are doomed, but if we have lost Jones for the season, its a substantial loss. I said in another thread, we lost our best player at each level of the defense in Tre at CB, Milano at LB, and Jones on the DL (he has been the best player on the DL this year). And while Milano is the biggest loss, Jones is almost as bad. In fact, I would not hesitate to take Jones back over Tre if given the choice to get one of them back right now. Not a knock on Tre, but this team is better equipped for life without Tre than life without Jones who impacts the game more overall than Tre does.

Fixed. I don't think Dorseys offense he designed is really good conceptually, I think its more a function of us having an elite QB and he making any offense we run score points.

I mean its 2 totally different offenses. We are a pass first offense that runs the ball for balance at most. Colts are a run first team where running the ball is a focal point of their offense and have the OL to execute that. And best ability is avail-ability and Moss unfortunately kept getting injuries anytime he started to look like he could finally challenge Devin for touches. People forget, Devin had a very good YPC here, its not like Moss was behind a guy who wasn't effective at all. There just were not a lot of touches to go around here, so when you keep getting hurt and losing ground to the guy ahead of you, it further diminishes your opportunities. Not to diminish what Moss has done there, but there are a lot of RB's in the NFL that could go to Colts and do more with those opportunities than their current respective teams who don't have the level of OL Colts have and don't make running the ball a focal point of the offense every week like the Colts do. Right now, I wonder if Colts keep him and try and move him to a team that really could use some RB help and try and get some draft capital to keep building around their young QB and Taylor. There are some teams I could see making calls for him, probably the most obvious would be the Ravens.

I mean you don't know what McD has or hasn't said to Dorsey. When Daboll was here, McD started calling him out in press conferences by saying they need to run the ball more and establish a run game even though Daboll was allergic to runniung the ball. Daboll still didn't do it, and probably why there were reports of friction between the two. McD can tell Dorsey whatever he wants, but on gameday, Dorsey is in the booth calling the offense. And Dorsey can say he is calling these, the guys just arent executing. So I just don't think its fair to hang offensive play calling on McD right now, especially when we are the 2nd highest scoring team in the league and coming off 3 straight wins of 28+ points or more. Not shocking the HC won't be meddling in the OC's offense when its amongst the best in the league. McD has his hands full between HC and DC responsibilities.

This team still could emerge out of the AFC, but this team vs Niners feels like the last 3 times Bills made the SB where the NFC was the clear powerhouse teams and the AFC was weaker, so getting there was one thing, winning it was another. Losing Tre, Milano, and Jones (1 at each level of the D, and 3 of our best players) against a team like Niners is a big big loss in stopping what they do, which is already a style that would likely matchup well with our defense. Sorry, the part in red is just wrong. Jones loss is nearly as bad as the Milano loss. Jones has been the best DT in football this year. HIs impact is felt on all 3 levels of the team. His ability to get pressure up the middle and disrupt the QB not only makes Ed Olivers job easier and the DE's, but the secondary's as well as it forces the QB to get rid of the ball quicker and under duress creating more turnover and PBU opportunities. Make no mistake about it...Jones injury is significant and nearly as bad as losing Milano and worse than losing Tre. I mean if you told me I could choose to have Tre back or Jones back, I would take Jones and that is not a slight on Tre, that is because this team is more equipped to handle losing Tre and Jones has been that good. Agreed with the above. I think McD is a very good coach, and I am not down on him. But, there does seem to be these games where the Bills do come out flat. Even in games we win, its not uncommon for the D to give up a quick easy first scoring drive or two before it suddenly starts to clamp down. I guess you can say its good to see the team capable of making good in game adjustments, but why does it take that so often rather than coming out the gate that way. Inconsistency on offense I put more on Dorsey as in a lot of those instances his gameplan is just poor to start before they adjust. Agree 100% on everything in the Ugly...Dorsey had me furious yesterday totally abandoning what has been working perfectly all season. Allen has a perfect passer rating in play action on the season, his stats and efficiency are through the roof on under the center snaps. Yet we went right back to shotgun snaps most the game and didn't call an under the center call until several drives in. NOW...in Dorseys defense, many of the early drives stalled (3 in fact, and 4 total) on dropped passes. But it doesn't change the fact that he went away from our most effective styles of offense and did so most of the game. Not to mention his utterly stupid play calling in other parts of the game. For me...Dorsey is the new weak link...the new Frazier. He wasn't good last year and I don't see the growth this year. I feel duped because I actually thought the Miami game, easily his best game in his career, was the turning of the corner. Unfortunately, he reverted back to his other ways one week later. If he doesn't get his crap together and start using the talent on this roster better and building game plans around what we do best, I am going to be beating the drum of fire Dorsey all offseason like I did last 2 years with Frazier. I, and many others too, were right about Frazier, the D is so much better under McD and its not close. I fear the same may be true with Dorsey, just hope he proves the doubters wrong before our season sinks because with the injuries to the D, our offense is going to be need to be at its best week in and week out.

OL has been better, but they weren't great yesterday. No sacks has more to do with Allen and his ability to avoid them than how well the OL blocked. And one big sack was negated by helmet to helmet contact. Plus they had penalties that hurt us a lot too and we couldn't get anything going running the ball. I don't know, its hard to put the play calling and use of personnel on McD when its Dorseys offense. McD is already HC and DC, to expect him to have a heavy hand in the offense is unrealistic.

My issue with Dorsey is his insistence on ignoring the facts and talent. Allen and the offense have been better with Allen under center yet we again ran a ton out of shotgun again. I mean I think it was several drives in before Allen finally lined up under center. He is again not using the talent well either. For all this two TE attack talk, we once again ignore Knox is on this team and aren’t making much effort to get Kincaid the ball. And for all the mismatches Kincaid is supposed to be creating, we keep throwing short passes to him only. You don’t need a smooth athletic TE to throw 5 yard passes too. You get a guy like him to put pressure upfield, down the seem, mid range…not just short dump offs. We are running two TE’s out there a lot, but we aren’t throwing to them like we are. If you look at the stats of our TEs you would think we had one at a time out there and using them to block because neither is doing much as a receiver. And then there is tendency to make bone headed play calls. I really thought the Miami game was turning of the corner, but he reverted back this week and it’s concerning.

Fair enough, I was only commenting on what you wrote in your first post where you claimed to have turned the game off after one early play.

Come on, no disrespect but that isn't fair due diligence. You intentionally watched a game where he reportedly had a big one but immediately turned it off because you didn't like what happened on one play? That feels more like you were looking for confirmation bias of your skepticism than actually trying to watch the game and see what his potential might be.

No, he was and OLB drafted to be an OLB behind MIlano, they literally said this on draft night. They said he had potential at MLB as well but he wouldn’t be competing there this year. They literally said this before he ever stepped on a practice field. So no, your assumption is wrong. Many of us hoped he could be an option there when we didn’t know who would be MLB, but the front office and McD were not one of them as they said from the get go he wouldn’t be competing at MLB here this year. They didn’t want him trying to learn two positions.

What? They don’t play the same position and weren't competing against each other. So yeah this is incorrect.

I thought he did quite well for having to step in under these circumstances. I hate hate hate losing MIlano, but that being said, I’m actually excited to see what Dorian can do given the circumstances

I doubt it. Won’t rule it out, but seems unlikely, at least until they see how the D looks once the he guys who aren’t out for the season are back (Benford, Groot, Von) and mix with the guys stepping up for the ones filling in for the ones that are.