GaryPinC

Yea, dull stuff but Kelly's writing it for the Bills so he has to try to appear diplomatic. I generally enjoy his articles because as diplomatic as he tries to sound it's usually pretty obvious what he's thinking. Jim talking about Edwards wouldn't have attempted some of those Fitzp. passes downfield, sitting might allow Trent to refocus on playing his game and not just learning the game plan, point to Jim believing a large part of the offense's troubles are due to Trent's play. It's clear Kelly still believes Trent could be a good quarterback, unlike the article Jim wrote in 2007 when Trent replaced JP and Kelly pretty much threw JP under the bus. And I agree with others here that no way does this get posted if the front office wasn't willing to consider Fitzpatrick as full time starter. And while this article may seem like old news to those here at TBD, I find it worthwhile to know that Kelly sees things pretty much as a lot of us fans do.

Amen. The TO article in the Buffalo News: http://www.buffalonews.com/452/story/836566.html had this tidbit also: "The Bills do not use motion in their offense, as dictated by coach Dick Jauron. So Owens does not move pre-snap. He normally lines up as the flanker opposite Lee Evans. However, the Bills have lined Owens up as the slot receiver on occasion. That's the only moving around he does. Evans never moves from his "X" receiver spot." Not sure how the reporter knows this, but if true is just one more confirmation of DJ's incompetance. My personal opinion is that DJ plays a heavy hand in the structure of the offense and limits the types of plays the OC and QB can call. Especially in critical game situations. Yet the players seem to blame the OC. When Fairchild was on the way out, players like Evans were saying that they thought Schonert had good ideas about playcalling the offense. Same thing about AVP. Why don't some of these reporters look into DJ's role in all this? Now there's a story I'd really like to read.

That's a good point, but after so many years of mediocrity they could blame themselves but stop talking Jauron up like he's some kind of hero. Just my frustration I guess.

Oh, and as far as the discussion as to whether good coaches have to be hard nose jerks or nice guys, it doesn't matter. Good coaches have the ability to consistently put their team in a position to succeed/win, and they can skin that cat any way they want. How many times over the last 3/4 years has Jauron's teams squandered opportunities in close games to put the other team away, instead content to play it conservatively and trust that the other team won't overcome a 1 score deficit. When your coach/coaching staff consistently take your team OUT of a position to succeed that's the surest mark of a bad coach. You can forgive a coach an odd time or 2 for making a bad decision but Jauron's overall W/L record speaks for itself.

Do these guys not realize how much their head coach is to blame for all their losses? This is the third OC I have seen when the Bills go all-running plays to settle for a long field goal as time winds down. Bills deserved to lose for that crap but got lucky. At LEAST get it to the red zone before you go straight runs. That's got to be on Jauron. I still remember TE after last year's Browns game saying the coaches really prepared him well but the Browns defense completely changed its approach from what they saw on tape. How is that not the coaches' fault? Other players will say how well the coaches prepare them but the team didn't execute during the game. Ummm, if your game plan is seriously flawed, and the other team's isn't, chances are you won't be able to execute your game plan no matter how prepared you are or how good it sounds on paper. Does anybody believe great coaching/gameplan got them this win vs the Jets? I don't.

Yep Senator, you have convinced me that Mike Leach is a diva. I won't re-list all your post because it's so long, but first off the above quote was from April '09. Kudos to Mangini for sizing up Crabtree accurately and avoiding drafting him and his diva holdout. I also suspect Mangini had a good laugh about Leach calling him an idiot. The rest of your posts involve Leach hootin' and hollerin' about how wrong NFL coaches are about "system" quarterbacks from college and how he'll teach them all how to break in quarterbacks properly. Funny, I can't find any evidence of Leach coaching at the NFL level in any capacity, yet he knows exactly what they're doing wrong. None of Leach's quarterbacks in his OC/HC coaching career (Tim Couch, Josh Heupel, Harrel, etc) have ever been successful in the NFL, so of course it must be the NFL's fault. Just like that 2007 Texas game where he was convinced the officials stole the game from TTech. A lot of Florida and Oklahoma quarterbacks also have trouble leaving those offensive systems and making it in the NFL, but I guess the NFL is wrong on those also. Cripes, this guy sure likes to piss and moan and blame somebody else when things don't go how he thinks they should. He is a reasonably successful college coach but with Tech at 4-2 maybe he should just focus on leading them to a winning record this year. And if Leach makes it to the NFL, I only pray it isn't with the Bills. As bad as things are, that would be a jump-out-the-window-and-shoot-yourself-in-the-head-on-the-way-down move. Of course that's only my opinion.

These same prognosticators were trashing Derrick Anderson after his 2007 pro bowl season. I always thought he got a raw deal on that, I'm not saying he's a consistant pro bowl QB and he will throw some head-scratcher interceptions but so does Brett Favre. Bottom line is Derrick Anderson can play, and it's good to see him back starting. I think he's leaving Cleveland (he was quoted in the PD saying he's just playing out his contract right now) when his contract expires in 2 yrs. Brady is very much an unknown so I think it's too early to trash him. He's not a gunslinger like DA but has shown me some glimpses of promise when he's been in there. Problem is the Browns are pretty much like us. No coaching or front office consistancy and I think their OC sucks this year also. Edit: edited out link to Plain Dealer and am revising this post because of article by news herald: http://news-herald.com/articles/2009/10/14...1f806505732.txt. Not sure if anything the PD's been discussing is true. I also saw somewhere that Trent's contract is up after this season. Even if he did turn things around, what are the chances he would actually want to stay here anyways? I think we'll be needing a quarterback, one way or another.

Good suggestions my #1 would be this: 1. Get rid of the no huddle. I realize DJ/AVP don't necessarily intend to use it as a hurry-up, just to keep the defense off balance. The problem is, we've got 5 rookies on the OL (including S. Nelson) and only 1 guy with any significant NFL experience (Hangartner). Most likely their biggest issue right now is knowing their correct blocking assignments on every play (especially pass plays). Do you think Hangartner can handle making sure all these guys are on the same page, especially since this is his first year in our system? At least with a huddle they could gather themselves and discuss assignments more easily. I think all the false starts on Sun. are indicative that these guys are still trying to figure out what they're supposed to be doing and then AVP tries some fancy snap counts just to give them something else to think about. Somehow AVP has to find a comfort zone with the o-line and go from there. Defense is in real trouble at least until Puz gets back, and who the hell knows if he'll be able to keep his forearm unbroken. Trent Edwards seems to me like he has zero faith in the o-line to protect him. Can't really blame him for that but there are plays he gets adequate protection but it doesn't change his checkdown approach. If we're getting killed next week maybe we'll get a chance to see if Fitz can do any better. Even if they're worried about Runyan's knee, why not sign him and try and stabilize that O-line? Maybe he just wants too much money.

That whole situation was just such a defining theme of Jauron. Your defense just got gashed for a touchdown and is showing signs of wearing down. Offense hasn't done squat all day, 8 min left and you need minimum TD and FG to tie. 4th and 1 from your own 30. Try and spark your offense by going for it? Hell no, got to punt! After New Orleans got the ball back what was the first play Coach Payton called? Long bomb down the right sideline. Incomplete, but he sent the message to his offense that it was time to stomp on the Bills. And the rest is history. Jauron pretty much lost me on that one too. Don't care if I see them again this year(didn't bother to watch the Browns/Bills came here in Cleve). I always laugh when Jauron talks about putting his players in a position to succeed. He thinks that simply means extensive preparation. Hah. I laugh too when Lee Evans talks about the players simply having to execute. It's hard to execute when your morale has been broken by inept coaching.

Sadly, I haven't found too many unique foods/entrees here in Cleveland, great ethnic foods like Buffalo but not a lot of unique ones. If you're going to have Sahlen's I'd highly recommend picking up some of this: http://www.stadiummustard.com/ Good stuff and definitely an addictive Cleveland staple. Only other things I have found were Candy Buckeyes and grape pie: http://cleveland.about.com/od/northeastohi.../r/grapepie.htm Grape pie sounds wierd, but man is it good. Sorry, wish I knew of something good but kielbasa and pierogies would definitely work well. Potato w/cheese definitely a staple here.

The Browns just got rid of a headache. I live here in Cleveland and at least since the beginning of last season Braylon's not been focused when he's on the field. Tons of drops, but also not expecting the ball and not running good patterns. His stats last year belie the fact that he dropped a ton of throws all year. Sure, he's got a ton of talent, folks around here think he doesn't like being in this smaller market to begin with and he seems to have a pretty large ego. I agree with this thinking and quite a lot of fans are tired of their all-pro receiver seeming disinterested and screwing up. Throw in a couple injuries and the latest trouble punching a guy in the face which he may get a suspension for and it was the last straw. Couple that with Mohamed Massaquoi having a great game holding on to Anderson's lasers and bye-bye Braylon. Browns fans on the whole aren't too broken up about this for the reasons outlined above and I don't blame them. The easiest way to relate this to Bills fans is to pretend Peters wasn't traded this offseason and was here playing even worse than last year. Then he assaulted someone at a local bar Sunday night. Would you be sorry to see him traded? Sure he's a great talent but is mostly a liability during the game, and a crappy attitude to boot. Time for the Browns to move on. Gives them a chance to work Josh Cribbs and Brian Robiskie in more. Browns are better off with Cribbs or a rookie in there. At least they'll play hard and hold on to most of the passes thrown their way.

Good Question, I'm a big fan and live on the far east side of Cleveland (Willoughby). Which Panini's was it as there's a number of them around Cleve and the suburbs? My kids are just starting to get old enough that I may be able to slip out on Sundays to catch the game so I'd definitely be interested to know if there's a "Bills" bar here. Sorry I don't have any good info for you. Gary

I believe I'm understanding your intended use of the hyperbole but part of my point is that you choose to use this hyperbole at all. You call these folks bipolar headless chickens, but what does that make you? So there's a group of people who get bipolar over the Bills and there's the group of people(like you) who get bipolar over people getting bipolar about the Bills. Other than a different bipolar trigger, I don't see a lot of difference between the 2 groups. The funny thing to me (imo) was that the headless bipolar chicken group was closer to being right than your "all is well, remain calm you headless bipolar chickens" group. And in all honesty, I don't think I was extreme but I felt the offense had some significant problems based on its preseason performances. Believe me, I fully agree with your distaste to the extreme reactionism that regularly occurs on this board. I do my best to ignore it and not participate in it because everyone's entitled to their own opinion but then to engage it simply prolongs it. Unfortunately, I could now be considered guilty of doing that too, so I'll stop. I'm not intending to be insulting with this so my apologies in advance if it comes off that way, you seem reasonably minded and I'm just asking you to consider the entire picture here.

I think everyone realizes preseason games dont count. When will you admit PRESEASON GAMES DO MEAN SOMETHING While some around here were pretending that the putrid performance in the preseason by the offense was something to be dismissed, it was the final straw for Turk Schonert and Langston Walker. Trent Edwards and Lee Evans, who both were talking to the press like the performances were meaningless, were voicing their worries about the offense to Dick Jauron behind closed doors. While I understand that some people here were getting way to worked up and fatalistic about the preseason, I had to laugh at the others mocking them and acting like it was nothing. It was clear in the preseason that something needed to be done about the offense and it was. That was the undeniable truth and the corrective actions of the Bills were the ultimate proof of this truth.

That'd be my reason also. Because of this, I'm guessing that's why they won't resign Walker, if they can't get or don't want Runyon look for them to sign a serviceable backup and let Scott make his own way. I'm sure there'll be plenty of b*tching on this board but I think Kugler wants guys with the right attitude and mobility.

I agree with you completely with all this. In addition, I would just add that Roscoe is one of those players who simply spends too much time running back and forth across the field instead of up and down it. When he first started doing punt returns he had this problem. Then for the past year or 2 he finally realized he needs to accelerate vertically then bust a move. But in the NE game I was troubled to see that on PR's he was again back to his old habits. I don't get to watch many Bills games but every time I have, when Roscoe's a receiver the moment he touches the ball he's trying to spin or bust some kind of move instead of just accelerating vertically. In his defense, I think he would be most effective catching the ball on the run but it seems like they don't use him that way much. Probably just doesn't have very good hands. IMO Maybin's gotten a lot of respect from the left tackle/guard. That'll end as more coaches look at film of him. He takes a lot of short choppy steps coming off the ball and looks like he's still trying to learn the game at this level. He's definitely got talent but hasn't proven it yet. Bills need his abilities badly though and I agree with the number of plays they're using him. To me, only if he becomes a big liabiity do you cut his plays. That being said, I really would like them to throw Ellis in there more. In the Pittsburgh preseason game, I was most impressed with his separation and ability to flow to the ball, it seemed better than Kelsay or Denney. I suspect the coaches want a game well in hand before they put him in there. We'll see.

Can't say I was ever very impressed with the O-line play under McNally. Between having mostly inadequate centers, Walker who was never that highly regarded when he was brought from Oakland, Dockery who left his heart in DC, and Peters who couldn't believe he was making less to much less than the rest of these immobile turds, the magnitude of the last few years' O-line problems is completely obvious. I don't think it's McNally's fault. It seems like he did favor those roadgrader-type lineman, the FO just never got in guys with the proper motivation and/or talent. It's obvious Kugler favors more mobile, slightly smaller guys with a nasty attitude. After watching the NE game, especially on a screen pass when Hangartner got out in space and basically layed out to make a block on a defender to spring Freddy, I'm very much liking this O-line. I think Kugler wanted this group of guys together and so guys like Langston/Dockery may have gotten screwed a bit. But where was Vince Wilfork in that game? This O-line has a ways to go to become a cohesive, dominant unit but I feel more optimistic about them then I have in at least the last 5 years. They at least seem to have a high sense of pride in doing their job well.

It seems to me teams are respecting his talent but his ability is not there yet. From what I could see, seems like the Pats committed 2 linemen for him early on then only the LT later in the game. Maybin actually appears somewhat tentative and slow to me, but because the LT is usually backing up so fast to respect his speed, it gives the illusion Maybin can get up the field in a hurry. He takes a bunch of short steps coming off the line, not the power strides I'm hoping for from a DE. Don't get me wrong, I think he has talent and will be a good player, I just think that right now he is feeling his way through things. He's obviously developing a spin move, but it seemed mostly ineffective last night.

In his interactions with the press, TE was also not the least bit concerned about the poor offensive showing in the preseason and talked like he had total confidence in the offense. After Turk was fired we came to find out him and Lee were both asking Jauron WTF? about the offense. It's great if he's truly confident but at this point I have to suspect false bravado. I guess we'll see on Monday eve.

How do you KNOW this decision was part of the long term plan and wasn't abruptly decided very recently? We do, and you seem to be part of the "let's just blindly trust management/the PLAN" herd. Bhaaaaaaaaa!

When I saw Bryan at the Pittsburgh game he was around the play or making a play 1 out of every 4-5. The other plays he was just getting blown up because he couldn't keep his separation from the O-lineman. He'd be a big liability in a real game. He's a practice squad project if he's even still eligible. At least Kelsay and Denney don't get blown up quite as much as he does. We really do need to replace those 2 though. I expect Ellis to really expand his playing time with experience this year. Not sure if he'll be a dominant DE but easily better than the Kelsay/Denney monster.

What I hope is that RW had a meeting with DJ before DJ called to let Wilson know he was firing Schonert. A conversation along the lines of "Dick, I've got a really bad feeling about our offense this season. This wasn't what I had in mind when I kept you on this year. You've got a week to let me know how you intend to fix the problem or I'll consider YOU to be the problem." Look at the similar history of our offense through 2 coordinators under Jauron: -conservative playcalling and gross ineptitude inside the red zone. -lack of screens and play-action passes -not allowing QB's to audible at the line of scrimmage -dink-and-dunk passing game -work on attacking offense during training camp/preseason never to be seen during the real games I hope it's coincidence that there were 2 OC's who sucked in almost exactly the same way, but with a self-professed conservative head coach, I personnally believe Jauron has played a large role in all these similarites, particularly in the red zone. My hope RW had this initial meeting was to let DJ know he needs to change his conservative philosophy. Jauron's explanation for his decision is hilariously 3rd person and reeks of Freudian undertones. All I hope is that Jauron stops obsessing about mistakes and lets his team play ball. Kind of funny to see all the BS from the coaches and players such as Edwards "We'll be fine offensively, totally confident, etc. " is just so much fluff. Obviously Lee Evans couldn't stomach the company line. We all knew these guys were blowing smoke up our keysters but it's nice to see it farted back in the coaches' faces. C'mon AVP and let's go Bills.

Yea, and even though TE seems to compliment the coaching there's got to be players on that team disgusted with the coaching but unwilling to speak out. These are pro atheletes but how do you play hard when always forced to play it safe and react to what the other team does? In one of these articles over the last couple weeks it was mentioned that the Bills didn't run screens last year because their linemen weren't quick enough to get out in space and make the play work. Any real coach knows screens can be a critical play in slowing down a defensive push. If I had an o-line that couldn't move their fat a$$es enough to set up a screen, I would let them know in no uncertain terms that we need to be able to execute, then I would make them run the same screen play over and over and over and over again in practice until they could do it quick enough. DJ and Turk just cross it off the list and move on.

Well, I would hope they could at least execute that 20%. They don't appear able, and regardless of the score that's really concerning to me. For a team as unestablished as this one, that's why they play the preseason, IMO. Also, to evaluate your rookie talent.

Agree with your assessments completely, WVU. My brother and I were at the game in the nosebleeds (which is really way the hell up in that stadium). Some things to add: -O-line still hasn't gelled, it seemed to me that Pittsburgh played base defense most of the time but when they brought LB blitzes Buffalo didn't handle it well. Just worry about this unit when the stunts and blitzes of regular season set in. -Maybin did ok but wasn't that impressive to me in this outing. Didn't expect much from him though and it seemed to me Pittsburgh game-planned for him and his speed with double team and LT/LG quickly dropping back in pass protection. Give Maybin credit for maintaining separation and having field awareness -Buffalo was clearly auditioning Copeland Bryan and Ellis with the 1st team D. To me, Ellis won this competition. He always seemed to maintain good separation from the blocking and was very aware and moving well to the play on the field. Bryan was active and had a couple decent plays but he also wasn't establishing good separation much of the time and getting blown up. As much as I'd like to see Denny/Kelsay gone I think Bryan'll be the odd man out in the DE contest but hopefully he can be put on the practice squad because he clearly has potential. -Nic Harris spent no time with the first team D. Can only assume he doesn't know the defensive playbook well enough, though Ellison did make a couple good plays last night. -1st team offensive line had no substitutions the entire time they were out. Those hoping for Bell to step in at LT will have to wait until the regular season. For the record, I think if Bell gets his shot move Walker back to RT, either Butler or Levitre coming off the bench (I favor Butler in reserve). Wood played some second team at guard, spent no time at backup center and realistically it's not an option in my mind that they try him at center this year. -Trent Edwards is just a mess. It seemed to me he's checking down off his downfield reads too quickly and content to dump. Pittsburgh played some good coverage but Evans would break away from single coverage after TE had looked elsewhere. Also, in the second quarter, TE got pushed out of the pocket and scrambled right. Josh Reed was running a flat route on the sideline which he quickly turned upfield when Trent was flushed. The DB froze for a second and Reed was open for a full second before the safety came over to help. All this was right in front of TE and he never took advantage of it as he was focussed short. TE does not appear comfortable nor on the same page with his downfield recievers. -Poz looked good, Donte is an ok safety but not the impact safety we were hoping for. -Looking at Dominic Rhode's kickoff return in the second half, it seems like he does have some gas left in the tank so that's good news. Bobby April's return teams look really sloppy though. -On Pittsburgh's offensive touchdown, Buffalo's LDE (Denney I think) was lined up so far off the end of the line of scrimmage that the touchdown run was only a formality. How the hell do you line up so far down the line in a goal-line D? -Overall, this whole thing was just ugly, not much of any D-line push/pass rush and the offense was just putzing around out there. Left just before the end of the 3rd quarter because sadly getting back to Cleveland a little earlier was much more appealing than stomaching watching the backups screw around. -The sad thing about watching the Bills is that they just seem to react to the other team and have no identity to assert on the other team. For those who like to fly the "it's just preseason/doesn't matter banner" I understand that but can only say this: The score is meaningless but our first team O can't even execute basic plays in these games. D is not much better. How they pull this together in time for the patriots I have no idea and will pray that somehow it happens. At this point I do not expect them to beat the Pats and am just hoping it isn't a complete debacle.