GaryPinC

The charging buffalo really pops out on the white helmet, which is why I like it the best. No to the red! Preference is probably based on what you grew up seeing. The Bills sucked in the red helmets too before Polian came along.

I do agree with you, you do realize the wiki link, while discussing the much greater picture in this debate, has it's own slant? WRT the perks in the field, it's not a tiny minority. I'm sorry, you really don't understand the world of academic research. There's not a lot of money in science and any funded PI being able to go out and give talks (beyond presenting at scientific meetings) is an important component to getting their name out there, collaborative efforts, and extra income. WRT Mann, I don't think he anticipated as much criticism as he deservedly got, so it's irrelevant to his actions. But I do think he enjoys the attention. But you do realize his "wins" mean there is still a temperature rise, though not as great as he originally published, the guy replaced tree ring temperature data with satellite temperature data conveniently at the exact point where the tree ring data diverged (stayed static or showed cooling) from the satellite data and never mentioned it in his publication? This is shady science at it's best. There were assumptions and parameters that either sides in this debate can manipulate to their convenience. Who's right? Well, why discuss because everything's "settled"? That polarizes mentalities and only inflames things. When I have time I'll dig more into the wiki links. No worries, sarcasm is difficult to pick up over the internet but you're probably the best at it I've seen. I read this thread because there can be some great references here but I really don't have the time or desire to engage in pissing matches.

No, true scientists are the same as everyone else. They have to eat and provide for themselves and their family, and when the money's short their way of dealing with it depends on their character which is no different from anyone else. Which is why attention-seeking scientists are hard to take seriously.

Exactly, thanks. All these guys are less than open with their data and methodologies, claiming it's too complex for non-climate scientists to understand. BS. Any scientist who reads and tries to utilize research papers smells the corners these guys cut so they can claim "settled" science. No real scientist calls things "settled". Things are accepted until evidence arises to challenge it. Any respectable scientist is just the opposite of these guys, they want their work open and critiqued so they can have new angles to explore and test.

The motivation is securing grant money to keep your job, prestige, and lab going. Prestige gets you speaking engagements which brings in more money. Sadly governments don't fund for good science that proves something doesn't work, they fund positive results. The ego of scientists get in the way when they form a hypothesis and need it proven to keep the grant $ coming. I don't trust anything Michael Mann does. The fact that he is willing to snipe Pat Sajak's twitter declaration says everything about him as a scientist. I haven't delved into every link of this source and it's not my expertise so I can't say how much of the assertions are true but read it, especially towards the bottom. I've done research in drug discovery and currently cardiology and I've seen scientists manipulate their data akin to what is asserted here about Mann: http://a-sceptical-mind.com/the-rise-and-fall-of-the-hockey-stick totally true what they say about the peer review process also. The peer review doesn't delve into the raw data, it simply looks for holes and inconsistencies in what the paper is trying to assert. Labs fall into conflicting hypotheses and theories then people choose sides. If you happen to be on the opposite side of a reviewer you will get a bad review. If you're not on the right side of some cliques you won't get your work published in certain journals no matter how good it is. Don't get me wrong, there are many upstanding high-character scientists but there are also many who are willing to tweak data because they're convinced the answer they seek is in there but there's too much noise.

Great points, and I definitely agree with you about his performance against OSU. Hack definitely had his ups and downs as a freshman. I guess my bias is that it's unfair to call Guiton second best in the conference since he didn't play enough though he certainly excelled when given the opportunity. No official word that he is a Bills free agent only a Columbus station claiming he was invited to Buffalo to tryout. Hope we do bring him in though. Thanks for the info.

Thanks for discussing Guiton, buckeye fans. Really impressed with his tapes though not enough of him under duress. But definitely a great pickup for the Bills, love how he throws to hit his guy in stride. He has a slower throwing motion but so did Bernie Kosar. Bernie was successful because of how cerebral he was of the game. Wouldn't be surprised to see Tuel gone. Oh, not sure "most" analysts would say the Buckeyes had the 2 best QBs in the big 10. Mr. Hackenburg out at Penn State is pretty good too.

I agree, and to add to what you're saying I look at Watkins' highlights as a man who is driven to be the best. He appears to be relentless in the small amount of film I've seen of him. I caught Polian commenting on ESPN about the trade saying he had concerns because the Bills could have simply picked up Beckham at 9 and not given up all the picks. I do believe Whaley mortgaged the future because he believes Watkins has the elite talent and drive to be the best. Which in my mind is the proper way to build a winner.

Having experienced a miscarriage in my life (and seeing the sonogram) I just can't imagine why any decent human being would cherish a memento of this event?

One of my favorite experiences was working for an oil company's pipeline maintenance gang on my summers off from college. We were out in Western PA at an oil tank farm (depot) and our group set up an overhead aluminum canopy in 3 days to cover the fueling pumps for the semis. Roughly similar to what you might find at any gas station. Well the local union saw that and forced their way onto the job site. Made us dismantle it because it wasn't our job to set it up so of course we did it wrong. It was over 3 weeks before those union experts got it set up again.

Great, thanks! I saw Article 7.1 but hadn't been able to pinpoint those definitions. 'preciate it. It still seems to me from what I did read is that while the Bills could talk to Owners about moving the team after the lease expires, if word got out or if the public knew the potential owners would take the team away that could do economic harm while the talks were ongoing and could be basis for county/state to go to court. I'd be curious to know your opinion on that?

Did you find the section in the general lease agreement about the Bills terminating the lease in year 7? Specifically are there any conditions to this or solely at their discretion? I couldn't find the section skimming through and this is much more your area than mine. Thanks for your help! Some other facets of the non-relocate agreement that seem significant to me: Section 3 b) Bills can't even talk to potential relocation buyer unless relocation will take place after termination of lease or the Bills are already in arbitration over terminating the lease. But county/state can order injuction if they have evidence these discussions cause economic harm before the end of the lease. Section 4: Transfer of franchise: Bills will put a lein on the franchise that new owners must abide by all lease and non-relocation terms. Section 5: Liquidated damages: Both Bills and county/state acknowledge that actual damages are difficult to assess and forcing Bills to play in the Ralph or not being allowed to play elsewhere are the most effective measure. State/county must also try to seek damage relief in court before using $400 mil fund Section 8: Miscellaneous: "(ii) Each Party hereby agrees that all actions or proceedings arising directly or indirectly out of this Agreement shall be litigated only in the Supreme Court of the State of New York, Erie County, or the United States District Court for the Western District of New York. Each Party expressly submits and consents in advance to such jurisdiction and waives any claim that Erie County, New York or the Western District of New York is an inconvenient forum or an improper forum based on improper venue." So no change of venue for disputes either. Things have been stacked to favor the team staying here.

Don't forget about the state appointed committee also. If any of these organizations feel the Bills are even talking to a ownership group indicating a possibility of a move they can file an injuction/take court action. The groups can also name their appropriate compensation/remedy for these actions and if the groups or court fail to remedy this then the $400 million kicks in. The team has to play their games at the Ralph through the terms of the lease unless all these groups, with the NFL and potential new owner(s), can agree on an alternative course of action. That's what I get from reading sections 2 and 3.

Biggest thing to me that is being minimized is the fact that Erie County and the publicly appointed Stadium commission have to sign off on any transfer of ownership. Also the NFL, of course. But, these two public entities can block the sale of the team. Bills are still allowed to play one regular season game in Toronto or alternate location and one preseason game every other year. Also if the NFL selects them for an alternate location game. Other than if the stadium has a physical problem prohibiting full seating or playing of a game, every other game HAS to be played at the Ralph. Mr. Wilson did the area a huge favor with this. I think the cheaper buy-out provision in year seven is meant for if the team wants to relocate out of Erie County but within Western NY and Erie County refuses to sign off on it.

This was probably 15 years ago but 5 of us were out at a bar in the burbs there and when 4 am rolled by and we wanted another round the bartender said LCB guys never check up on a place at 4 am and we could keep drinking till we're done (5:30). Good times!

Say what??!!?? Look at his forearms in the photo. They should be perpendicular to the bar and his have a slight inward angle but not much. It's probably his normal grip considering he's 5'9". If his hands were where the spotter's are then we could talk close grip.

That Miami game breaking the streak in 1980 cemented things in for me. Not that I would have ever given up on the Bills, but as a kid (I was 10) they sucked so consistently that decade I definitely had times I doubted whether I wanted to endure a lifetime of that! Our house in West Seneca abutted US 219 and I was in the backyard helping my dad scrape the loose paint off our detached downspouts so we could repaint. I remember everything. Mostly sunny day, my dad had rigged up a sandblaster (SOB stuck me with the wire brush!) and to protect himself had donned a heavy green plastic rain parka, welding goggles, and ventilator mask making him look amazingly like an illegitimate Tusken raider/Jawa love child. But that's my dad. I remember the old silver radio in the grass, trying to keep that AM station coming in and struggling to hear over the sand blaster. Just following the game while working, slowly realizing Buffalo wasn't going away like normal, interrupting my dad but he was sure they'd blow it, then just stopping work in the fourth listening to Fergy bringing them back and the defense hanging on by seemingly the skin of their teeth. Jumping around the yard like a nut after it was over, listening to the scene afterwards and finally hitting the TV watching them pass the goal post up the stadium. What an amazing feeling from that game and season. The traffic jam on 219 lasted at least twice as long as usual. The minute people got stopped they were out of their cars dancing and celebrating with each other it took 'em a while to realize the road had cleared in front of them. Nobody cared, what a fantastic reward after the previous decade! Go Bills!

The thing about what Ralph did with the lease is that if it's apparent the new owners will move the team to Toronto, then I would think ticket sales would fall through the floor until 2019. Maybe lack of attendance would allow breaking the lease early and paying the 400 million but that would still take years to resolve. I know if a Toronto group takes them over the team is dead to me unless they announce plans for a new stadium in WNY.

I'm well aware of this fact, I was simply addressing the value of your post. Plus, your post doesn't directly discuss him getting kicked off the team!

IMO Freddy's earned the right to keep playing until it's completely obvious to everyone he's ineffective. That hasn't happened yet, and if it does I suspect Freddy will have already announced his retirement. I would expect this from a team-first humble leader and warrior.

You were 14 days late with this post.

Haha. Great one!

I think you have great points on this and in all honesty it makes the most economic sense for the new owners to have a stadium in Niagara Falls also. Plus, I would think casting aside the Argos to plunk an NFL franchise down would really alienate football fans in Canada let alone the Buffalo fans. Factor in the lukewarm response to the Bills playing up there and you have to wonder if an NFL franchise would be successful up there. Always makes me laugh how the NFL stares at the size of the market and lets that mandate a franchise. That's never worked for LA and I have to think it won't until you address how to get people to support the franchise. Completely on board with PTR's points about foot or shuttle traffic across the rainbow on game day. Any tailgating Canadians can cross at Lewiston but the rest can park in NF, Canada and more quickly come across. Alleviating as much border-crossing pain as possible is critical. If done correctly, having a stadium in close proximity to the border would be of huge benefit. Regarding the local politics, I think the casinos, hotels and restaurants/entertainment would really support this and pressure local leaders to do so and I would think even the most despicable politicians would play nice for an opportunity of this magnitude. I just see all the businesses on both sides recognizing the opportunity to offer packages and sell game days into all inclusive weekend deals during a traditionally slower time of the year. Having the stadium functional as a conference center and other events would seem critical also. When I consider that NYS may step in to help or manage the financial situation, the franchise needs to keep and grow as much of its fanbase as possible, and the new owner needs to have the team in the best US regional economic situation, Niagara Falls seems like a no-brainer.

If it's any consolation, the sarcasm meter was off the charts in your second reply to Tom.

I agree and am in DC Tom's camp about his private vs public persona. Whatever his faults, I'll always applaud Bill Cosby for trying to publicly point out the African-American community needs to take more responsibility for its problems.